Returning Labatte to Glory + A New Award

[Beketov 8,639]

As most members of the VHL know, up until S59 the Sterling Labatte Trophy recognized the league’s top Defenseman every season. With the award changes in S59 it was, however, changed to the top offensive defenseman award.

 

In recent seasons, spearheaded by @Victor and others, this decision has been called into question. The problem was never splitting the Defensemen awards but rather tarnishing the Labatte as simply a different play style rather than the best. Today the league is officially announcing a fix to that mistake. Effective immediately the Sterling Labatte trophy shall officially return to being awarded to the league’s top defenseman.

 

Where does that leave the Wylde award you may ask? While options were presented for removing it; the BOG, with help from the award committee, has decided it’s best to leave the award in place. Rather than removing the Wylde we have decided to keep the split and have top offensive Defenseman continue to be its own award, henceforth known as the Alexander Valiq Award, named for @Koradek‘s Hall of Fame Defenseman who revolutionized offensive play from the blue line.

 

The 4 recipients of the Labatte under the top offensive category will be henceforth moved to being Valiq recipients to keep things clear when we go to look at Hall of Fame voting and those seasons shall remain with no winners of the Labatte. However for future Hall of Fame discussions the BOG will take into consideration if players in question would likely have taken the Labatte under normal circumstances.

[Gooningitup 1,290]

So now we have 2 awards based on offensive production from the blueline LOL dont kid yourselves the Labatte was always the top offensive defender with semi decent d stats. Now we just have 2 awards for points further making the point of league wants people to build different ways but focuses on offense forcing everyone to build the same

[Beketov 8,639]

8 hours ago, Gooningitup said:

So now we have 2 awards based on offensive production from the blueline LOL dont kid yourselves the Labatte was always the top offensive defender with semi decent d stats. Now we just have 2 awards for points further making the point of league wants people to build different ways but focuses on offense forcing everyone to build the same

Originally I thought that as well which is why The original push was made to separate them. However if you look at the past winners you’ll find the split more even than you’d think. Even the final winner of it before it was changed was Fabio Jokinen who was known for defensive play, not offensive. It depended heavily on the season.

[Advantage 2,769]

12 hours ago, Gooningitup said:

So now we have 2 awards based on offensive production from the blueline LOL dont kid yourselves the Labatte was always the top offensive defender with semi decent d stats. Now we just have 2 awards for points further making the point of league wants people to build different ways but focuses on offense forcing everyone to build the same

Not really.  Labatte has generally been rewarded to offensive defenders that also hit and remain solid blocking shots..see all those who dominated it like Sullivan, Low, Braxton, etc.  There is a reason Valiq never dominated it.  To certain players it could end up being the same but then it just gives defenders more to get since often forwards dominste the rest

Edited November 3, 2018 by Advantage

[Quik 4,113]

Yeah, it actually usually goes to the most well rounded defender. Last season Smirnov or kovalchuk (whichever is banas dman) won top offensive, but MJ would have gotten the labatte. When MJ won offensive, AAR would have gotten the labatte. 

 

The Labatte-proper usually goes to the actual best defenseman. It’s just that they are usually also among the best offensively as well, which creates the perception that it just goes to offensive D

[Devise 4,475]

Basically what they all said. Labatte isn't most points, and if you look through you'll find tons of instances where D who had the most points did not win. Further, the switch to the Valiq also allows us the opportunity to reformat a bit how we look at "most offensive." Points are points. But goals? D who get goals are a different breed. The Valiq trophy does look at points yes, but a D with 5 less points and 15 more goals would likely be looked upon a lot higher than the D with the higher points advantage. 

 

These aren't just "stats" awards. They are stats after careful debate and deliberation. The Labatte however needed to return to how it as originally because it's always been a debate to see which D has the best combination of all stats, defensive included. Splitting the other two now allows us the chance to look at them a bit more clearly without trying to consider that someone who would of won a Labatte in a previous season getting screwed. The Best D is after all the Best D. But we did want to keep the reward for the specialist players, as they were smart introductions. 

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

Except the "Best Defensive Defenseman" trophy doesn't actually go to the best defenseman at defense - just the player with the large numbers of hits and SBs. 

[Devise 4,475]

12 minutes ago, Fire Hakstol said:

Except the "Best Defensive Defenseman" trophy doesn't actually go to the best defenseman at defense - just the player with the large numbers of hits and SBs. 

 

Not completely true. Hits, Shots Blocked and _+/- all play a factor. That way if a good player on a quality team has a little less shot blocks due to the way stats work but is otherwise a better player than stat pad Mcgee on the shitty team, he'll see an argument/likely win. The thing is we kind of came to these conclusions based on how people were voting/discussing the awards in the Committee already. 

 

Not a single one of these awards go to the player with the "most" of any one single stat. That said, if your argument is shots blocks, hits, and plus minus doesn't always have to do with defense than that is fair. But as a specialist trophy, I think it's fine. 

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

1 minute ago, Devise said:

 

Not completely true. Hits, Shots Blocked and _+/- all play a factor. That way if a good player on a quality team has a little less shot blocks due to the way stats work but is otherwise a better player than stat pad Mcgee on the shitty team, he'll see an argument/likely win. The thing is we kind of came to these conclusions based on how people were voting/discussing the awards in the Committee already. 

 

Not a single one of these awards go to the player with the "most" of any one single stat. That said, if your argument is shots blocks, hits, and plus minus doesn't always have to do with defense than that is fair. But as a specialist trophy, I think it's fine. 

 

My point is those stats themselves are shit stats to judge defense by.

[.sniffuM 1,741]

On 11/3/2018 at 2:59 PM, Fire Hakstol said:

 

My point is those stats themselves are shit stats to judge defense by.

 

We don't exactly have anything better to judge that with and it's already been proven moving to STHS v2 would take too much re-working of core elements of the league.

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

17 hours ago, .sniffuM said:

 

We don't exactly have anything better to judge that with and it's already been proven moving to STHS v2 would take too much re-working of core elements of the league.

 

Then we just don't have a defensive defenseman award.

[.sniffuM 1,741]

On 11/5/2018 at 5:16 PM, Fire Hakstol said:

 

Then we just don't have a defensive defenseman award.

 

Yep, why change anything ever?

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

13 hours ago, .sniffuM said:

 

Yep, why change anything ever?

 

I'm not against change. I just don't see the point in an award we don't have accurate or appropriate stats for.