Free Position Change in VHLM

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

I propose we let one happen in the VHLM for free. Why you may ask? What if someone want to change up their position so they can get a better draft position? I mean think about it. If someone is a forward and defense is in high need in the draft, they can swap and probably get picked higher up. Also would work the other way around. This would help out anyone who may not be enjoying the position they picked and they could opt out. Of course this would only apply to forwards to defense or vice-versa.

[Quik 4,113]

Not sure I really agree. The position switch isn't extraordinarily expensive. It can be easily purchased by the time you enter your post-draft season. If it's about changing your draft ranking, then let teams know you plan to position switch. If it's about wanting to switch positions, do it once you have enough money, which, again, not much is needed...

[Beaviss 4,949]

1 minute ago, Quik said:

Not sure I really agree. The position switch isn't extraordinarily expensive. It can be easily purchased by the time you enter your post-draft season. If it's about changing your draft ranking, then let teams know you plan to position switch. If it's about wanting to switch positions, do it once you have enough money, which, again, not much is needed...

 

Players can also swap positions within two weeks of creation right?

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

3 minutes ago, Quik said:

Not sure I really agree. The position switch isn't extraordinarily expensive. It can be easily purchased by the time you enter your post-draft season. If it's about changing your draft ranking, then let teams know you plan to position switch. If it's about wanting to switch positions, do it once you have enough money, which, again, not much is needed...

 

But what if they want to go a different route ahead of time. Say their team is already loaded at a position and they want to move to something else to help the team out? Could be beneficial for both sides involved.

 

Just now, Beaviss said:

 

Players can also swap positions within two weeks of creation right?

 

This is aimed at those past the two weeks.

[Quik 4,113]

3 minutes ago, Beaviss said:

 

Players can also swap positions within two weeks of creation right?

 

Can switch from skater to goalie, and vice versa, within one month of first-gen creation.

 

Re-creates who want to switch Skater/Goalie can do so until their pre-draft playoffs start (i.e. S64 playoffs for S65 draftees), while retaining their original carryover, but lose all tpe earned with the retiring player.

 

Forward/Defence needs to be purchased no matter what

[Quik 4,113]

1 minute ago, Trifecta said:

But what if they want to go a different route ahead of time. Say their team is already loaded at a position and they want to move to something else to help the team out? Could be beneficial for both sides involved.

 

I'm against letting players make decisions for the VHLM team that would affect their entire career. Much as they may want to help out their VHLM team, they'll only be there for a max of 2-3 seasons, and what happens if they regret making that decision later on?

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

1 minute ago, Quik said:

 

I'm against letting players make decisions for the VHLM team that would affect their entire career. Much as they may want to help out their VHLM team, they'll only be there for a max of 2-3 seasons, and what happens if they regret making that decision later on?

 

But what if it was a mutual decision though? Like I don't think a GM would strong arm another member into it. Like if someone feels they want better playing time but say someone has 6 active forwards and like one or two active defenders. They could then swap to defense and help out. It would be a decision made by themselves for the better. I'm certain there is some people out there who probably wish that they could do so right now.

[Quik 4,113]

2 minutes ago, Trifecta said:

 

But what if it was a mutual decision though? Like I don't think a GM would strong arm another member into it. Like if someone feels they want better playing time but say someone has 6 active forwards and like one or two active defenders. They could then swap to defense and help out. It would be a decision made by themselves for the better. I'm certain there is some people out there who probably wish that they could do so right now. 

Like I said, that's a decision for their VHLM career that affects their entire career. It's not something I'd want a first-gen member deciding within their first season in the league (and would not allow a re-create for free when they know the league already). If, by their 2nd full season, they want to make the switch, then they can afford to make the purchase, which nullifies any need for a free switch.

[Peace 1,518]

Then make the position switch not a one time use item! 

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

1 minute ago, Peace said:

Then make the position switch not a one time use item! 

 

Exactly. As long as it's a purchasable option, why limit it right?

[Baozi 1,635]

I think it should be allowed for people that started as goalies.

[Quik 4,113]

On 1/4/2019 at 4:08 PM, tfong said:

I think it should be allowed for people that started as goalies.

 

On 1/4/2019 at 10:38 AM, Quik said:

Can switch from skater to goalie, and vice versa, within one month of first-gen creation.

 

[Baozi 1,635]

I think it should be allowed in general throughout. Just not in the reverse.

[Quik 4,113]

1 hour ago, tfong said:

I think it should be allowed in general throughout. Just not in the reverse. 

??

 

A month is enough time for a someone to figure out if they want to be a goalie or not. Recruitment crew is actively letting them know what's up. Allowing it in the middle of a VHL career doesn't really make sense. One day you're a star goalie, the next you're a star C? At least F-D / D-F make a bit of sense lol (not the only reason, but still)

[Baozi 1,635]

55 minutes ago, Quik said:

??

 

A month is enough time for a someone to figure out if they want to be a goalie or not. Recruitment crew is actively letting them know what's up. Allowing it in the middle of a VHL career doesn't really make sense. One day you're a star goalie, the next you're a star C? At least F-D / D-F make a bit of sense lol (not the only reason, but still)

 

Was thinking more like the case of being stuck as a backup forever in the VHL actually.

[Tagger 2,722]

I think my biggest problem to our current approach of things regarding goalies is what impact it's going to have on the VHLM experience for new members in the future. It's only natural that warning players upon creation as a goalie of their potential lack of playing time in the VHL is going to lead to much less candidates for the goalie position in the VHLM. Looking at the current setup, this season is going to be the last VHLM season for three of the current goalie crop (Nixon and Rift through promotion to VHL, Weekes VHLM rights expiring), leaving it with two high TPE inactives (Smith and Sohva) and two actives (Pouta and Cole) entering Season 65, and my concern is that shortage of goalies is going to lessen the VHLM experience for everyone (E.g. You aren't going to have the same five team playoff chase we had last season with only four capable goalies) unless a change to the system is made. 

 

I know that post doesn't provide any solutions to that problem, but if people were to agree with the same stance made, I could certainly try and figure out a potential solution.

Edited January 7, 2019 by Tagger

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

3 hours ago, Tagger said:

I think my biggest problem to our current approach of things regarding goalies is what impact it's going to have on the VHLM experience for new members in the future. It's only natural that warning players upon creation as a goalie of their potential lack of playing time in the VHL is going to lead to much less candidates for the goalie position in the VHLM. Looking at the current setup, this season is going to be the last VHLM season for three of the current goalie crop (Nixon and Rift through promotion to VHL, Weekes VHLM rights expiring), leaving it with two high TPE inactives (Smith and Sohva) and two actives (Pouta and Cole) entering Season 65, and my concern is that shortage of goalies is going to lessen the VHLM experience for everyone (E.g. You aren't going to have the same five team playoff chase we had last season with only four capable goalies) unless a change to the system is made. 

 

I know that post doesn't provide any solutions to that problem, but if people were to agree with the same stance made, I could certainly try and figure out a potential solution.

 

So why not set everyone up with like 100TPE bots to play goalie? That would solve the problem of when you defer those from playing goalie and teams can still have a decent goalie.

[Quik 4,113]

11 hours ago, Trifecta said:

 

So why not set everyone up with like 100TPE bots to play goalie? That would solve the problem of when you defer those from playing goalie and teams can still have a decent goalie.

As long as teams aren't foregoing member goalies to start the bot, I'm fine with that solution to the goalie issue.

[Baozi 1,635]

1 hour ago, Quik said:

As long as teams aren't foregoing member goalies to start the bot, I'm fine with that solution to the goalie issue.

 

Wasn't that the issue in the past? People don't draft goalies unless they are star players because they will just prefer using the bot?

[Quik 4,113]

3 minutes ago, tfong said:

 

Wasn't that the issue in the past? People don't draft goalies unless they are star players because they will just prefer using the bot?

Not sure? I've never been heavily involved in the VHLM.

 

I would say that in order to have a bot goalie on the roster, there must be no goalies available - whether it's waivers, or another team having 2. So if 4 teams have 1 goalie, one team has 2, and one has 0, the team with 0 would have to trade for the backup or find one on waivers.

[Baozi 1,635]

3 minutes ago, Quik said:

Not sure? I've never been heavily involved in the VHLM.

 

I would say that in order to have a bot goalie on the roster, there must be no goalies available - whether it's waivers, or another team having 2. So if 4 teams have 1 goalie, one team has 2, and one has 0, the team with 0 would have to trade for the backup or find one on waivers.

 

So in my mind as a GM I can totally sabotage another team by drafting multiple goalies and then giving them a 30 tpe leftover goalie and they'll be forced to use that over a 100 tpe bot goalie. Or the alternative is to find a way to only use the bot goalie.

 

I'm being semi-rhetorical because I had to deal with this back in the day when we had bot goalies being stronger than an actual goalie so people would prefer having the bot goalie. When i VHLM Gmed i actually did that personally as well.

Edited January 8, 2019 by tfong

[Quik 4,113]

1 minute ago, tfong said:

 

So in my mind as a GM I can totally sabotage another team by drafting multiple goalies and then giving them a 30 tpe leftover goalie and they'll be forced to use that over a 100 tpe bot goalie. 

 

Fair enough. Not sure what the solution is, tbh. Maybe a 50-70 TPE bot? Better than nothing, but a human goalie is still worth more, especially come playoffs.

[Baozi 1,635]

Aren't bot goalies currently set at 50 anyways? Which is fine in a vacuum but basically any newly create player should easily surpass that even, which is kind of what you want. This also retains goalie values.

 

My issue isn't at the VHLM level though, its mostly at the VHL level that some people be stuck as backups  and won't see that landscape unfold until they get there and then suddenly find themselves "fucked."

 

So i'd petition that the position change be allowed for goalies to skaters (just not the opposite) in the VHL a little easier. 

[Quik 4,113]

Not really sure about VHLM bots.

 

As for members being back-ups, that's something they are warned about, heavily (which is where @Tagger's legitimate issue of VHLM goalies drying up comes from). Allowing them to switch to skater allows a pretty big competitive advantage.

 

In your words, as a GM I can totally steal a great prospect by drafting a goalie who is falling due to the lack of need, to be my "back-up", then having them switch to skater.

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

I'm pretty sure VHLM goalie bots have been at 50 TPE for a while now actually for this very reason - to give a team somewhat of a chance if they don't have a goalie on their roster. Previously, it was just the standard no TPE goalie, and teams would get absolutely shredded. I feel like we made the VHL back up 250 TPE for the same reason.

 

RE: goalies...this might be a temporary problem anyway if VHL expansion is something that's looked at.