Derek England has retired!

[Beketov 8,639]

1 hour ago, Nykonax said:

350 TPA Cap, but you can keep banking without going up the next season. Once your drafted the SHL team owns the rights, and can send you down to your SMJHL team. You can spend up to 5 years in the SMJHL, but the last season you need to clear waivers, where any SHL team can get your rights.

 

It's more like NHL/AHL opposed to our NHL/CHL

Our system did used to be similar to that but it started becoming an issue where players that wanted to stay down would get called up or M teams would get screwed because their top player would get called up to be depth for a playoff run, etc. It all just became very messy to both keep track of an enjoy so we separated the experiences more or less. To each their own though.

[Victor 10,526]

Wow an old school SHL vs VHL conversation, is it 2014 again?

 

I was a member there for the first 12 seasons, made a Hall of Famer on minimal effort as you do. Then came back a few times in more of a troll mode (last notable contribution was fucking over an expansion franchise by exposing their flawed tampering rules and making a team losing like three first round picks for messaging me once).

 

Its weird, the SHL was set up around S17 in the VHL and was meant to be the antidote to our hardcore 9 TPE cap, grading-centric “PT league”. It was literally advertised as a non PT league but somehow over time it completely flipped and now you need to put more effort to make it there.

 

We had some tetchy periods in our relationship usually when we had more heavily SHL based drafts but I’m glad we basically stopped speaking to each other around S50, it was pretty toxic.

 

I never understood two things about the SHL:

1. How they kept attracting such a younger age member base which resulted in all the drama but also meant most members lifespans were shorter (guaranteed they don’t have as many old farts as us).

 

2. How they were so good at recruiting in general. But we’ve fixed that up now, our member counts are very similar (looking at practice facility vs activity check counts) so not really sure what they have to offer at this point that is useful to us. I’ve certainly always preferred the fact the VHL has more of a focus on the actual sim league aspect rather than being more of a side thing over there.

 

 

I also have no idea how much crossover we have now, might be worth having a poll lol (although I also don’t want to give the fact the SHL exists much attention). But other than their juniors system which I don’t think we can feasibly replicate with career length limits, is there actually anything else they do which is better? I’m sure we’d take any reasonable improvements on board, just not really sure if there is anything.

[fonziGG 1,065]

7 hours ago, TheFlash said:

 

Yeah, maybe a bit drastic but it started in the SHL discord, someone posted a screen cap of it on the SHL forums and within a few hours it was 20+ pages of almost unanimous comments against him and his thoughts. He furthered it by claiming it was because he was older and likened it to he not liking rap music. It spilled into the CHL discord where he was very active, as most of the members there are from the CHL. He must of just figured to cut his losses, maybe he plans on making a new account down the road? Who knows.

 

Before he left the SHL, he changed his profile picture to Bobby Riggs and sig to "BATTLE OF THE SEXES" featuring Billie Jean King and Bobby Riggs. For those who don't know, Riggs was a big time tennis player in the 30's and 40's and claimed in the 1970's that women's tennis was so inferior to mens, that at 55 years old he could beat one of the top women in her prime, Billie Jean King. She beat him and it was a pretty big deal for recognizing women in sports and such. So he was relishing in the hate for sure. 

[eaglesfan036 4,583]

So 2014, 2019, in 2024 we will have another big SHL vs VHL debate

[TheFlash 317]

14 minutes ago, Victor said:

Wow an old school SHL vs VHL conversation, is it 2014 again?

 

I was a member there for the first 12 seasons, made a Hall of Famer on minimal effort as you do. Then came back a few times in more of a troll mode (last notable contribution was fucking over an expansion franchise by exposing their flawed tampering rules and making a team losing like three first round picks for messaging me once).

 

Its weird, the SHL was set up around S17 in the VHL and was meant to be the antidote to our hardcore 9 TPE cap, grading-centric “PT league”. It was literally advertised as a non PT league but somehow over time it completely flipped and now you need to put more effort to make it there.

 

We had some tetchy periods in our relationship usually when we had more heavily SHL based drafts but I’m glad we basically stopped speaking to each other around S50, it was pretty toxic.

 

I never understood two things about the SHL:

1. How they kept attracting such a younger age member base which resulted in all the drama but also meant most members lifespans were shorter (guaranteed they don’t have as many old farts as us).

 

2. How they were so good at recruiting in general. But we’ve fixed that up now, our member counts are very similar (looking at practice facility vs activity check counts) so not really sure what they have to offer at this point that is useful to us. I’ve certainly always preferred the fact the VHL has more of a focus on the actual sim league aspect rather than being more of a side thing over there.

 

 

I also have no idea how much crossover we have now, might be worth having a poll lol (although I also don’t want to give the fact the SHL exists much attention). But other than their juniors system which I don’t think we can feasibly replicate with career length limits, is there actually anything else they do which is better? I’m sure we’d take any reasonable improvements on board, just not really sure if there is anything.

 

Some good points Vic, 

 

I don’t know why or how they have a younger group. I don’t know how accurate it is, and I bet if you took ages of people on both forums you’d be surprised. I’ve learned the ages of some people around here who I thought were much older, so it’s tough to tell. I’d be really interested to know though.

 

They have a very high activity level. They average about 100 more activity Check posts vs practice, so not a lot. Both forums are active. I’d like to know what you mean when you say it’s more of a side thing? They have a ton of members who are into the double digits for seasons played for their current player. Very common. 

 

You can see my previous post for what they do better. Cash for media and their PT system is better IMO of course 

 

[Victor 10,526]

4 minutes ago, TheFlash said:

You can see my previous post for what they do better. Cash for media and their PT system is better IMO of course 

I’m not sure cash for media is compatible with welfare. Or also having welfare is basically the alternative. If you struggle in a week you can claim a bit less TPE, if you don’t you can set yourself up for a few weeks by writing a massive MS.

 

The limited time themed PTs are my point on it being too much effort to make it there. We have seasonal theme PTs now but there’s little scope to add any more weekly tasks without increasing the TPE cap.

 

Obviously we could completely overhaul our PT structure and copy theirs but not sure that’s worth it. Implementing a couple changes otherwise is too difficult.

[TheFlash 317]

1 minute ago, Victor said:

I’m not sure cash for media is compatible with welfare. Or also having welfare is basically the alternative. If you struggle in a week you can claim a bit less TPE, if you don’t you can set yourself up for a few weeks by writing a massive MS.

 

The limited time themed PTs are my point on it being too much effort to make it there. We have seasonal theme PTs now but there’s little scope to add any more weekly tasks without increasing the TPE cap.

 

Obviously we could completely overhaul our PT structure and copy theirs but not sure that’s worth it. Implementing a couple changes otherwise is too difficult.

 

Fair enough, and I don’t think VHL needs to really do anything. No issues getting new members.

 

but their PTs are 150 words. Trust me( there’s no effort lol

[Victor 10,526]

43 minutes ago, TheFlash said:

 

Fair enough, and I don’t think VHL needs to really do anything. No issues getting new members.

 

but their PTs are 150 words. Trust me( there’s no effort lol

I sometimes struggle to pump that out for a VHL.com article so just go for a press conference lol. So I suppose that’s our alternative to that.

[chillzone 231]

SBA >

 

[.sniffuM 1,741]

And now for my unsolicited opinion on the manner.

 

-I 100% buy into the notion that the SHL has a higher average age than the perception around here. Even in my few brief forays into the league I remember a lot of veteran members on the site stating they were in their late 20s, and that was years ago at this point. People can be fuckheads no matter their age, as the VHL has seen with some new members that have joined and been quickly banned in recent months. I think the reasons it's so associated with the SHL are:

 

(1) It seems they're a little more lenient on how far they'll let someone push things before completely removing them.

 

and much more importantly:

 

(2) The SHL was the primary reason sim leagues survived for a long time, with their uncanny recruiting ability trickling down to other leagues over time. As they were many peoples' first foray into sim leagues for a long time, they had the biggest share of said fuckheads by far, but that could've been mainly a numbers thing.

 

-I've never been a fan of the way SHL handles their point earning as I'm not a fan of the money system. It's super messy (although I've heard it's automated now) and it's just not a system that works to fairly compensate graphics. Meanwhile I remember in my time there and at PBE that I just don't really care about my PT when it's just 150 words and no one's really bothering to put in effort to theirs. Also it's a system that strongly values consistency, not my strong suit.

 

-In the same vein, there's plenty the VHL does that I don't agree with. When it comes to welfare, I think the SBA does it best, with welfare worth 3 and knocking your weekly cap down to 6. Sure, the VHL relies on those members claiming 4 or 5 a week from their welfare, but it still makes it hard to justify the effort needed to earn that extra 1 point (for me). Another thing I think the SBA does better is limiting members to 9 TPE without job pay. However, over there there's a lot more jobs with their massive NCAA along with a few other things, as well as the fact that most jobs are standardized to pay 3 per week.

 

-Back to SHL. I think the main positive of their league is the career length as well as the fact that, with their money basis, contracts actually mean more than 90% of people signing for minimum. The drawback for me is that it often takes a bunch of seasons earning all possible TPE in the juniors to finally make it to the pros in my experience, although it looks like they have more teams now than before so that could be mitigated somewhat.

 

-I think the VHL would benefit massively from lengthening careers. While I disagree with a lot of how the weekly cap is structured here I think it works fine as is, but career length is where I see the VHL kind of falls behind. I understand rosters are already packed as is, but I think another harsher update scale (the one I proposed before the recent scale change was a bit more harsh than the current one, but the league could benefit from one even harsher than that, at least at the top of the scale) and a raised VHLM cap that would allow most any draft prospect to stay down in their first season would benefit both the pros and the M.

 

That's all I've got for now. Now I'm ready to be told again why none of this would work.

[NotAVHLM-GM 1,858]

None of this would work 

[Advantage 2,769]

Tbh I spent a lot of time on the SHL.  Even went first overall in a draft.  Didnt mind the community.  It has bad apples but all leagues do..I did find they had a few in leadership spots tho.

 

Nevertheless I like the VHL TPE concept and site more and remain loyal since I cant do multiple leagues anymore but the SHL was fun when I was there.

[Dil 1,744]

On 7/18/2019 at 11:46 AM, Enorama said:

insist is superior to any portal system

They insist it's superior because they don't have it lol...

[Enorama 1,980]

On 7/24/2019 at 9:30 PM, Advantage said:

I cant do multiple leagues anymore

 

As he creates in the EFL

[Nykonax 1,550]

3 hours ago, Enorama said:

 

As he creates in the EFL

and SBA

[Sixersfan594 247]

Going on the Money Vs. TPE system.

1 week of training = 1 mil/5 TPE = 1000 words

1 week of training = 6 TPE = 500 words

 

there's a clear difference in effort needed. 

[Advantage 2,769]

13 hours ago, Enorama said:

 

As he creates in the EFL

No I didn't?

[Advantage 2,769]

9 hours ago, Nykonax said:

and SBA

And while yes I did, my post was in reference to leagues not tied together (ala do two PTs a week).

 

The affiliate welfare system makes it less stressful.

 

But my post referenced specifically SHL and VHL.

[Enorama 1,980]

1 hour ago, Advantage said:

No I didn't?

 

It must have been the SBA where I saw you in the chat box then  my point stands

[Advantage 2,769]

40 minutes ago, Enorama said:

 

It must have been the SBA where I saw you in the chat box then  my point stands

Indeed as I pointed out what burns me out is doing multiple point tasks like when I was in shl and vhl.  I never could save up enough money to not be stressed.  Was fun otherwise tho

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

2 hours ago, Advantage said:

And while yes I did, my post was in reference to leagues not tied together (ala do two PTs a week).

 

The affiliate welfare system makes it less stressful.

 

But my post referenced specifically SHL and VHL.

 

Yeah, I havr an SBA player now and while I'll never be a star since I'm only hitting the 9 TPE cap and not 12, its real easy to hit that 9 with a point task (Mostly VHL but its nice to be able to switch it up every once in a while with an sBA one) and 3 sim participations.