Rookie Min games to Qualify for Stolzshweiger

[Jubis 1,281]

Rookie of the year award eligibility 

I can not find a rule for a minimum amount games a rookie can play and not burn their rookie season. 

 

The NHL rules are 25 games in any one season and not more than 6 games in any two proceeding seasons. Also a age restriction of 26 yrs. 

 

In the VHL without rules in place the rookie goalies will be the most affected by this. Some may play the required minimum 8 games and that's somehow their rookie season. 

 

I would recommend this for the VHL: 

● 20+ games in any one season

 

● 8+ games in any two consecutive seasons. 

 

● only considered a potential rookie for first 3 seasons. (Rookie contract)

 

Am I the only one who thinks a rule put in place will help? I see no harm 

 

******I'm only pushing for eligibility for rookie of the year award eligibility********

 

 

Thanks 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Jubis

[Beketov 8,638]

The issue is that everything in the VHL is based off draft year basically. A rule like that would allow goalies to play backup for several seasons, all while massing TPE, without affecting their retirement season or depreciation years. Even if they in play backup for 2 seasons that’s easily a 200 TPE advantage.

[Big Mac 310]

4 minutes ago, Beketov said:

The issue is that everything in the VHL is based off draft year basically. A rule like that would allow goalies to play backup for several seasons, all while massing TPE, without affecting their retirement season or depreciation years. Even if they in play backup for 2 seasons that’s easily a 200 TPE advantage.

So if they don’t finish a rookie year they don’t get depreciated?

[Jubis 1,281]

I wasnt clear in my post. Sorry totally  my bad. I now edited my post. I'm only pushing for eligibility for the rookie of the year award. Nothing else. @Beketov

Edited March 24, 2020 by Jubis

[Rayzor_7 741]

The problem I see is purely the TPE advantage. A goalie could play backup for two seasons and amass 750+ TPE then swap to being a starter and potentially thrash any actual rookie. While more fair to the goalies you also made it unfair for the skaters.

 

I wouldn't mind seeing goalies allowed an extra season if they play backup in their rookie season (say 15 game max). But that's a thought for a different discussion thread that I'll probably go make

[Devise 4,475]

Yeah @Beketov I really don't think the TPE advantage is that big of a deal here. Their overall career years would still line up with what they are, but in terms of eligibility for rookie of the year I think it makes sense. 

 

If you are arguing that Goalies would have some sort of advantage over rookie skaters who can't bank TPE in advance of having a better rookie of the year season, I'd like to point out that goalies right now are in GENERAL at a huge disadvantage across the league. Higher TPA goalies struggling, starting jobs not always guaranteed. The likelihood that a high number of non TPE whore goalies are going to come in and not play more than 8 games for at least their first season, if not more, is pretty high. I don't think giving them the advantage of a little extra TPE for when they challenge for that Rookie season really hurts. I think the 20 game limit for the most part makes sense too. 

[Peace 1,518]

Yeah I’m with Devise on this one. 

[Jubis 1,281]

Just now, Peace said:

Yeah I’m with Devise on this one. 

Which essentially means you're with me 

[Enorama 1,980]

2 hours ago, Jubis said:

I would recommend this for the VHL: 

● 20+ games in any one season

 

● 8+ games in any two consecutive seasons. 

 

● only considered a potential rookie for first 3 seasons. (Rookie contract)

 

So basically what I suggested  

[Jubis 1,281]

Just now, Enorama said:

 

So basically what I suggested  

YES !!!!!!!  

[Beketov 8,638]

15 minutes ago, Devise said:

Yeah @Beketov I really don't think the TPE advantage is that big of a deal here. Their overall career years would still line up with what they are, but in terms of eligibility for rookie of the year I think it makes sense

He hadn’t appended it yet, I was under the impression he meant more than just rookie designation.

[Devise 4,475]

Just now, Beketov said:

He hasn’t appended it yet, I was under the impression he meant more than just rookie designation.

 

If he he hasn't officially appended the post you can see in his response his clarification was just about the eligibility over the Rookie of the Year Award, not actually changing eligible rookie seasons and extending careers or anything. 

[Jubis 1,281]

Just now, Devise said:

 

If he he hasn't officially appended the post you can see in his response his clarification was just about the eligibility over the Rookie of the Year Award, not actually changing eligible rookie seasons and extending careers or anything. 

To add the award winner is also voted on. Doesn't guarantee a goalie will win the award. I just want them to be eligible based on a rule we could put in place 

[Beketov 8,638]

Just now, Devise said:

 

If he he hasn't officially appended the post you can see in his response his clarification was just about the eligibility over the Rookie of the Year Award, not actually changing eligible rookie seasons and extending careers or anything. 

Typo on my post. Was meant to be hadn’t, not hasn’t. He has indeed appended it now, just had not done so when I first posted.

[Devise 4,475]

Just now, Jubis said:

To add the award winner is also voted on. Doesn't guarantee a goalie will win the award. I just want them to be eligible based on a rule we could put in place 

 

Yeah implementation of this isn't really a big deal. It's not like anything would have to change. Literally @Victor would just need to make sure to remind himself to watch all goalies in their first 3 seasons of play, and cross them off the list in terms of rookie season eligibility and considering them for the ballot the moment they play 20 games or more in one of their first 3 seasons. As he is generally the one right now posting ballots and monitoring awards on the BoG end formally. 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Devise

[Jubis 1,281]

29 minutes ago, Devise said:

 

Yeah implementation of this isn't really a big deal. It's not like anything would have to change. Literally @Victor would just need to make sure to remind himself to watch all goalies in their first 3 seasons of play, and cross them off the list in terms of rookie season eligibility and considering them for the ballot the moment they play 20 games or more in one of their first 3 seasons. As he is generally the one right now posting ballots and monitoring awards on the BoG end formally. 

@Victor ^ this 

[Quik 4,113]

I'll chime in with my $0.02

 

Personally, there's not enough seasons in a career to be giving players 3 cracks at a rookie season, skater or goalie. It's also extremely unlikely that someone will be called up one season, and send back to the VHLM the following season, especially with the TPE cap in the VHLM.

 

If there is a change to include a GP minimum to qualify as a rookie, I'd say something more akin to:

 

• If the player does not meet the minimum GP in their 1st VHL season (I'd say 15-20 for goalies and 25 for skaters - to avoid anyone called up at the deadline losing out on being a rookie the following season), they maintain their rookie status the following season
• Player loses rookie eligibility once they exit their rookie contract, OR if they play 1 VHL game in consecutive seasons.

 

I know that some goalies will get a little screwed by this, but any goalie with enough TPE to graduate after the draft will be at at least 550-600 TPE by the time their 3rd season rolls around, and goalies having more than that by that point isn't all that rare. To me that's not a rookie, goalie or not.

Edited March 24, 2020 by Quik

[solas 1,946]

Ironically this is something I've thought about for a while, I started writing an article a while ago about a topic related to this from the VHL's early history and included a section making an argument for an official rookie qualification rule (maybe you'll see the finished version in a couple months from now, who knows).

I strongly feel like there should be some kind of a rule on this rather than just leaving things the way they are.  Otherwise it just kind of leaves things up to the decision of the award voters every year and that can kind of leave some people feeling overlooked without an explanation.

I saw Victor this brought up on another thread, but Claudio Martucci won it in S25 after being a backup who barely played the season before (plus a full VHLM season in S23 after being drafted).  So there's precedent for players being eligible after player a low number of VHL games, we've just never had an official rule about it.  Personally I like @Quik's suggestion more, I feel like being in the VHL for two seasons (even if you don't play very many games) should probably eliminate you from being a rookie as you've been on a VHL team's roster.  I would add that I think the rule regarding a rookie contract shouldn't apply to players who have been in the VHLM.  It's a rare situation that probably won't apply too often but (for example) if you've been in the VHLM for three years after being drafted and spend your fourth season post-draft in the VHL that should count as your "rookie year" to me, regardless of contract.

Edited March 24, 2020 by solas