How one statement created an entire GM philosophy.

[JCarson 723]

What is success for a VHLM GM. For those of you that don’t know the VHLM GM (as with the VHLE and VHL) have a discord chat group that includes them the AGM and the Commissioners. It gives us a place to discuss things specific to GM’ing, get clarification of rules or unique things going on in the league and discuss trades. For the most part it is a relatively boring place. But every now and then something gets said that sparks a larger conversation. 

 

During one of these conversations a GM made the comment that their team was not doing well this season as they had a lack of players and since our waiver pool this season has been minimal, they have not been able to pick up any players to expand their roster. Now I could take this article several diverse ways at this point based on that one statement. 

I could start a brand-new conversation which would only reiterate prior conversations on recruitment which inevitably leads to the conversation on retention. I could critique the GM’s choices with trading draft picks and players but that doesn’t solve anything. 

 

What I would like to address is the misconception of what the role of a GM in the VHLM is. Don’t get me wrong, we have an excellent group of GM’s right now who are all very dedicated to their teams. The problem is we serve two groups of people with two vastly dissimilar needs. 

 

Group 1 is the established player, this is easily defined as the recreate pool, people who are on their 2,3 and sometimes 7th (How many players would someone who started in season 1 have had by now?) but this group also extends to first generation players with other sim experience who pick up the league mechanics quickly. This group sees the VHLM as a place to get past, but also a place where they want to win, winning is fun, I don’t blame them. I understand this thought as my current player just won the Founders Cup as part of the Saskatoon Wild in season 93. 

 

Group 2 are the players who struggle with the league mechanics as a whole. Generally, first gen players in their first season but I have also experienced a few players who went through as a welfare/practice facility player their first time through and now want to be something more. They are looking for help with trivia, career tasks and point tasks. 

 

The issue that arises is that the better you do with group 2 the harder it is to satisfy group 1. Let me explain and use my current team as an example. At the end of season 93 Mexico was not in a good place in the standings. We were going to make the playoffs but only because 2 other teams were in worse positions. So, I made the decision to allow those players who were going to go to the VHLE in the next season the opportunity to be traded to teams that could contend for the cup. I shipped 5 players out and got several draft picks in return. My thought was to use the resources I had in season 93 to try and make season 94 and 95 better. (planning for Group 1) I think I did well. I then used those draft picks to secure some excellent first-generation players in the draft and used a few future year picks to acquire additional players for season 94. 

 

The result of that activity is a team of 8 forwards (2C 6W), 3 defenders and with the addition of a waiver claim 2 Goalies. And currently Mexico sits first in the Western Conference and second in the league. We will contend for the Founders Cup this year. My Group 1 players are happy. With slightly over 3 weeks of sims left to complete, playoffs and offseason and with the work I have been doing with the first-generation players I expect that at the end of the season going into the draft (and assuming I pick up no new waivers) I expect to have 5 of 13 players on my roster next season, potentially as few as 2 if some of them add even 1-2 additional TPE to their growth over the remaining weeks before the season 94 cut off. So, if I do an excellent job with my Group 2, my first-generation players and get them building TPE and moving forward in the league I am inevitably destroying my ability to be competitive in Season 95. Yes, for those of you who don’t know this, there is a direct correlation between the number of players on a team and how well they do in the standings. 

 

I am hoping that most of you have noticed what I have been alluding to but if you haven’t, I am going to come out and say it. We judge GM at all levels on their ability to win Cups, good GM’s win, right. That is right, isn’t it. Wrong. In the VHLM that is the farthest from the truth. In the VHLM good GM’s teach players how to leave the VHLM, how to create good TPE earning habits that will take them far within the VHLE and VHL structure. An excellent VHLM GM will be so good at this that they will have so few players returning each season that it will become difficult for them to ever compete for the cup. 

 

If a GM were so good, that every player that they picked up in the draft, they would be able to teach to build TPE habits that those players only ever spent 1 season in the VHLM. Couple that with our current recruitment structure, where a GM could only expect to get 1 to maybe 2 waiver players a season, and depending on when those waiver players signed it is feasible that an excellent GM would only ever have at max 5 players on their team at the start of the next season. 1 waiver from the prior year plus 4 players from the draft. I’ll let you in on a secret, you don’t win in the VHLM with 5 players, especially if you don’t get lucky enough to acquire one of the minimal goalies available. 

 

So, who consistently wins VHLM cups? It is not the Bad GM’s. They destroy their team every year by making bad draft choices, making bad trades, and never building any players. No Bad GM’s lose. Which means that unless you dig in really deep a Bad GM and an Excellent GM look remarkably similar from a results standpoint. Those who win cups are the Mediocre GM’s, they have a good locker room that is active (because they have players) they make good trades and draft well. They also do well in the standings so have the tendency to attract more waivers. What they don’t do is create high earning TPE players that leave, they create active mid earning players that will stay 2-3 seasons in the VHLM that always fuel the team’s roster. Mediocrity wins cups consistently in the VHLM. 

 

I have come to the conclusion that excluding this season, that is a result of inheriting a team that was completely devoid of the ability to win. A team that included several welfare only players that were at the end of their 2-year run in the VHLM. Which gave me a onetime chance to grasp for the championship, that I hope to never win the Founders Cup. It is my goal to enter every season with the expectation that I will have so few players that I will never be able to win. I want to ensure that every one of the players I draft (and yes, I took all first-generation players in the season 94 draft) have everything they need to create TPE earning habits that ensure they never stay within my organization. My goal is to create the all-star players of the VHLE and VHL.  

 

Honestly, there is a reason VHLM GM get a 4 TPE job pay each week. Losing consistently while doing all the other aspects of the job correctly is difficult. But that is the job. 

I am hoping I didn’t make too many enemies with this article. I know there are a few GM’s who pride themselves on their cup wins and playoff records. They do so many things well and should be proud of what they accomplished. I am just willing to take a different stance to this position, to measure myself by a different set of criteria. For me it is about getting players to the next levels of this league structure and having them be strong members of their VHLE and VHL teams. I hope to do this GM’ing thing for several seasons, enough that I can measure the number of cups that my players win at the VHL level. To me that is the measure of ultimate success. Let’s see where this experiment goes. 

 

Word count 1503, claim week 1 of 3,  sorry when I started this it was to be my VHL.com article for the week, it kind of got out of hand

[JCarson 723]

also claiming week 2 of 3 for week of June 16

[diacope 1,696]

what

[AJW 2,156]

My trophy case: 2 GM awards, 0 Cups

 

Thanks for making me feel better about Houston’s second round curse

[jacobcarson877 2,529]

VHLM is for teaching players how to be great VHL players!

I always viewed returning players as at least a partial failure on my part. Obviously not everyone needs to be a top earning player, but most players coming out of the draft only need to earn like 80-100TPE to cap out, so if I couldn't get them to earn 8-10/week, did I really show them the breadth of the league? My teams did well because I got a ton of waivers (chronically online), and got my waiver players going. We won through superior earning, not through superior returning players. Obviously some rules have changed since then, some helping and some hindering that cause (although all of the hinderings REALLY helped other issues, so the tradeoff made sense), but winning Cups is definitely not an indicator of who the best GMs at their mission statement are. VHLM (and VHLE) GMs that are truly great get players to graduate, and get them to earn consistently, whatever that may be, while showing them all of the options available to them. Can't make people earn, can't make people stick around, but they at least have to know, and be inspired.

[LucyXpher 1,409]

I completely understand your point about a good VHLM GMs main priority being development, but I strongly disagree with the premise that mediocre GMs win.  In my opinion, the best GMs will find a way to do both— and that winning AND development are absolutely not mutually exclusive.  
 

If a GMs priority is developing players and teaching them about the league, should they never draft recreates then?  But instead prioritize developing first gens completely?  What about the experience a good recreate can bring to a locker room?  I know in my first season as a player, that locker room leader was @crstats23– who, by the way, is not a max earner every single week, but has still created very effective players by remaining consistent and is a great presence in the locker room.  
 

Which leads me to my next point, you don’t need to be a max earner to get max enjoyment out of the VHL.  For some people, they just don’t have time for that with life, but still enjoy the community of the league and the fun of checking sims daily. There’s nothing wrong with clicking welfare, and it’s certainly nothing to be ashamed of.  If the best way for a player to enjoy the league is to click practice and welfare every week, then I say good for them!  
 

As an M GM, I’d certainly try to encourage them to try other things like press conferences, media spots/graphics, and trivia, because I enjoy those things and I think they can enhance the experience.  But if those things create too much stress for a player, or they try to do more than they’re ready to take on each week, they could easily drop off or burn out.  I think the best M GM will try to understand where each player is at and what they’re reasonably capable of doing week to week, with the main priority not necessarily being development in terms of sheer TPE earning, but teaching the league and helping players have fun. 
 

Fun should be the main priority, always— the VHL is not a job.  Oh, and one of the most fun things you can do is win!  I think, actually, the players on my roster that care most about winning are the first gens who, over the past season, have learned the system gradually and are now starting to flourish.  You suggested that if a GM has a lot of returning players, they’re likely not doing enough for development— please correct me if I’ve misunderstood, but I strongly disagree with that premise.  The players I’m personally most proud of are my returning players who started last season with 50-65 TPE and are now almost completely capped.  They’ve learned how to earn weekly and consistently and are enjoying the reward of being dominant players in the VHLM after playing most of last season in depth roles.  Am I supposed to hurry them along so they can be low-level E players after 1 M season?  And it’s not like I haven’t been encouraging them to earn more— their update logs will prove that— but I won’t do so at the expense of their fun.

It seems to me that the best/ideal M GM will find a way to balance winning and teaching.  I don’t see these as competing interests at all, but actually mutually enriching! Winning is fun and can be a great way to motivate new players to earn and invest more in the league.  Getting players earning and having fun will also lend itself to winning.  Sure, you might lose players who earn their way out of the M in one season, but then maybe that’s where drafting and scouting have a part to play?

 

Anyways, have this as habit of writing too much sometimes and I need to stop.. I do appreciate this style of media spot though as it’s definitely thought provoking and an opportunity to reflect on the role we share as M GMs, so thank you for that!  I’d be happy to chat more, but if I misunderstood or misinterpreted any of your points, please let me know, that was not my intention!

[AJW 2,156]

1 hour ago, LucyXpher said:

 But if those things create too much stress for a player, or they try to do more than they’re ready to take on each week, they could easily drop off or burn out.  I think the best M GM will try to understand where each player is at and what they’re reasonably capable of doing week to week, with the main priority not necessarily being development in terms of sheer TPE earning, but teaching the league and helping players have fun. 
 

…

 

They’ve learned how to earn weekly and consistently and are enjoying the reward of being dominant players in the VHLM after playing most of last season in depth roles.  Am I supposed to hurry them along so they can be low-level E players after 1 M season?  And it’s not like I haven’t been encouraging them to earn more— their update logs will prove that— but I won’t do so at the expense of their fun.

 

Happy to know you feel strong on these^ some great points, first point is brilliant. For the second bolded point this is something I always have to remind myself. Not everyone learns, earns, or burns at the same speed. Some pick up things faster than others, some people will quit at the start line if things look hard. I try to give all my players the same opportunities, it’s just their choice to take them or not, and at how quickly they are ready to take them on.

Edited June 9 by AJW

[Enorama 2,038]

6 hours ago, JCarson said:

How many players would someone who started in season 1 have had by now?

 

Roughly 10, assuming max career length.

 

9-season turnaround for 80 seasons + 10-season turnaround for 14 seasons.

 

Quite a bit more if you tend to retire early - there's actually at least one member with 12 players in the portal era (earliest one is S60) and at least a handful before that as well.

[Beketov 9,024]

7 hours ago, JCarson said:

How many players would someone who started in season 1 have had by now?

1. Sharpe

2. Beketov

3. Young

4. Kristensen

5. White

6. Chekhov

7. Miller

8. Holik

9. Sokolov

10. Thompson

11. Lahtinen

12. Emeritus

13. Calaway

 

Now that’s just me, I didn’t go full career the entire time (probably the majority weren’t actually) and also did briefly have 2 players so everyone will be a bit different but I don’t know if there’s anyone else around you could get that data from haha.

 

Given that retiring early was incentivized back in the day and almost everyone had 2 players during PP2 I would say that you’d expect most season 1 people, if they were around the whole time, to be above 10 players.

[JCarson 723]

3 hours ago, LucyXpher said:

I completely understand your point about a good VHLM GMs main priority being development, but I strongly disagree with the premise that mediocre GMs win.  In my opinion, the best GMs will find a way to do both— and that winning AND development are absolutely not mutually exclusive.  
 

If a GMs priority is developing players and teaching them about the league, should they never draft recreates then?  But instead prioritize developing first gens completely?  What about the experience a good recreate can bring to a locker room?  I know in my first season as a player, that locker room leader was @crstats23– who, by the way, is not a max earner every single week, but has still created very effective players by remaining consistent and is a great presence in the locker room.  
 

Which leads me to my next point, you don’t need to be a max earner to get max enjoyment out of the VHL.  For some people, they just don’t have time for that with life, but still enjoy the community of the league and the fun of checking sims daily. There’s nothing wrong with clicking welfare, and it’s certainly nothing to be ashamed of.  If the best way for a player to enjoy the league is to click practice and welfare every week, then I say good for them!  
 

As an M GM, I’d certainly try to encourage them to try other things like press conferences, media spots/graphics, and trivia, because I enjoy those things and I think they can enhance the experience.  But if those things create too much stress for a player, or they try to do more than they’re ready to take on each week, they could easily drop off or burn out.  I think the best M GM will try to understand where each player is at and what they’re reasonably capable of doing week to week, with the main priority not necessarily being development in terms of sheer TPE earning, but teaching the league and helping players have fun. 
 

Fun should be the main priority, always— the VHL is not a job.  Oh, and one of the most fun things you can do is win!  I think, actually, the players on my roster that care most about winning are the first gens who, over the past season, have learned the system gradually and are now starting to flourish.  You suggested that if a GM has a lot of returning players, they’re likely not doing enough for development— please correct me if I’ve misunderstood, but I strongly disagree with that premise.  The players I’m personally most proud of are my returning players who started last season with 50-65 TPE and are now almost completely capped.  They’ve learned how to earn weekly and consistently and are enjoying the reward of being dominant players in the VHLM after playing most of last season in depth roles.  Am I supposed to hurry them along so they can be low-level E players after 1 M season?  And it’s not like I haven’t been encouraging them to earn more— their update logs will prove that— but I won’t do so at the expense of their fun.

It seems to me that the best/ideal M GM will find a way to balance winning and teaching.  I don’t see these as competing interests at all, but actually mutually enriching! Winning is fun and can be a great way to motivate new players to earn and invest more in the league.  Getting players earning and having fun will also lend itself to winning.  Sure, you might lose players who earn their way out of the M in one season, but then maybe that’s where drafting and scouting have a part to play?

 

Anyways, have this as habit of writing too much sometimes and I need to stop.. I do appreciate this style of media spot though as it’s definitely thought provoking and an opportunity to reflect on the role we share as M GMs, so thank you for that!  I’d be happy to chat more, but if I misunderstood or misinterpreted any of your points, please let me know, that was not my intention!

Thanks for your input, I just want to make one note and that is I never said people needed to max earn.  Reality is there are a few very stress free ways to gain TPE outside of welfare and practice facility, that would allow players to gain the roughly 3-4 extra TPE they need each week to only play 1 full season in the VHLM.  Press conference, VHL article, fantasy zone, super coach, VHFL are all very easy to complete.  You add a couple of those each week and it is possible to consistently gain 8-10 TPE each week with minimal stress.  Add a career task (which you can take 5 weeks to complete) and many players could surpass 200TPE long before their full season is done.  Also add in first gen bonus both from store and reaching 100TPE.

If I look at my own player which was a max earner it is possible to be at 400TPE by the time you start your VHLE season (3 people did it this season, Leandro, Jacob and Myself) so 200 isn't some stretch goal that should require stress but will require consistency and learning how to manage the process.

Now all that said there are going to be players who choose to only do welfare and/or practice facility and I am happy they are around, have fun enjoy the experience but I my own experience has been that these players are willing to do more if they can be taught how to make the extra couple TPE easy to do. Nobody joins to just do there bare minimum and have a below expectation player, not everyone is driven to be the superstar max earner, but I believe that everyone can find a place in between.

[LucyXpher 1,409]

2 hours ago, JCarson said:

Thanks for your input, I just want to make one note and that is I never said people needed to max earn.  Reality is there are a few very stress free ways to gain TPE outside of welfare and practice facility, that would allow players to gain the roughly 3-4 extra TPE they need each week to only play 1 full season in the VHLM.  Press conference, VHL article, fantasy zone, super coach, VHFL are all very easy to complete.  You add a couple of those each week and it is possible to consistently gain 8-10 TPE each week with minimal stress.  Add a career task (which you can take 5 weeks to complete) and many players could surpass 200TPE long before their full season is done.  Also add in first gen bonus both from store and reaching 100TPE.

If I look at my own player which was a max earner it is possible to be at 400TPE by the time you start your VHLE season (3 people did it this season, Leandro, Jacob and Myself) so 200 isn't some stretch goal that should require stress but will require consistency and learning how to manage the process.

Now all that said there are going to be players who choose to only do welfare and/or practice facility and I am happy they are around, have fun enjoy the experience but I my own experience has been that these players are willing to do more if they can be taught how to make the extra couple TPE easy to do. Nobody joins to just do there bare minimum and have a below expectation player, not everyone is driven to be the superstar max earner, but I believe that everyone can find a place in between.

That's fair, thanks for clarifying!  I know you didn't say that people needed to max earn-- I think you did say 8-10 TPE per week in your post originally.  

I think we do also need to be careful comparing first gens to recreates like yourself, Leandro and Jacob.  I'm pretty sure Leandro has the record for the most TPE earned by a first gen player, Jacob is 2nd on the all time list, and you're 10th all time (honestly impressive).  My point being that most players won't have anywhere near that kind of drive to earn.  Also, factors like the timing of joining the league to maximize what you can earn in your first season, not to mention the time it takes for most people to figure it all out.  I wish I had known some of that when I joined since I was almost 100 TPE behind the players who were drafted 1st and 2nd in my draft season, and I max earned every week since I created.  It's certainly doable to clear the M in one season, but I don't think that's a reasonable benchmark or expectation to have for players or GMs-- to say nothing about preparing them for the next level.  Players learn at a different pace, even with a GM who is communicating well with them.  I've had some experience teaching music and I've had a similar experience there.  It's unreasonable to expect students to make progress at the same rate because there are so many factors involved with that-- family life, time for practice, interest, aptitude, other commitments, etc...  A good teacher will try to understand these things and modify expecations and methods to accomodate those differences-- without selling the student short, of course.

 

You're right, nobody joins to do the bare minimum, but alot of people join on a whim without realizing what's involved and it takes time to build up the habit and set aside time to write a media spot for example, or learn everything about claiming, fantasy zone, VHFL, etc... It's alot to take in and I think that's easy to forget once we understand it.  I really don't think we should underestimate that.  I mean, I had players that wrote media spots or created graphics last season and were forgetting to click the practice button the same week-- but it happens when somebody is learning and it can be overwhelming.  Another observation I had was the better the team performed in the sims, the more willing players were to try something new to earn TPE.  As a GM I could use our success as a motivator.  If the team is struggling to win and getting blown out every game for a 5 week season, I think it'd be pretty easy to fall off with earning, which is why I think it's important for GMs to build balanced teams with a variety of earners and experience levels-- some high end, some that might take longer to develop, and maybe the odd clicker.  I don't think we can brush success at this level away as insignificant because even if it doesn't matter to the GM whose main objective is development and teaching, it can matter very much to the players whose learning and development is affected by it. 

Anyway, I appreciate where you're coming from and it's obvious to me you want to do right by first gens, so I have no issue with that whatsoever, even if I don't completely agree with some of the points.   One point I really get stuck on is the suggestion that mediocre GMs win.  It's just not true.  It's possible to fluke your way to a league win if you've got simon in your back pocket, but by and large, I think the GMs who win are not mediocre at all and I'm not sure I like the idea of throwing shade at our peers who have sim success.  I mean that's what everyone's here for-- just like nobody joins to do the bare minimum, nobody joins to lose.

[tcookie 897]

14 hours ago, LucyXpher said:

I completely understand your point about a good VHLM GMs main priority being development, but I strongly disagree with the premise that mediocre GMs win.  In my opinion, the best GMs will find a way to do both— and that winning AND development are absolutely not mutually exclusive.  
 

If a GMs priority is developing players and teaching them about the league, should they never draft recreates then?  But instead prioritize developing first gens completely?  What about the experience a good recreate can bring to a locker room?  I know in my first season as a player, that locker room leader was @crstats23– who, by the way, is not a max earner every single week, but has still created very effective players by remaining consistent and is a great presence in the locker room.  
 

Which leads me to my next point, you don’t need to be a max earner to get max enjoyment out of the VHL.  For some people, they just don’t have time for that with life, but still enjoy the community of the league and the fun of checking sims daily. There’s nothing wrong with clicking welfare, and it’s certainly nothing to be ashamed of.  If the best way for a player to enjoy the league is to click practice and welfare every week, then I say good for them!  
 

As an M GM, I’d certainly try to encourage them to try other things like press conferences, media spots/graphics, and trivia, because I enjoy those things and I think they can enhance the experience.  But if those things create too much stress for a player, or they try to do more than they’re ready to take on each week, they could easily drop off or burn out.  I think the best M GM will try to understand where each player is at and what they’re reasonably capable of doing week to week, with the main priority not necessarily being development in terms of sheer TPE earning, but teaching the league and helping players have fun. 
 

Fun should be the main priority, always— the VHL is not a job.  Oh, and one of the most fun things you can do is win!  I think, actually, the players on my roster that care most about winning are the first gens who, over the past season, have learned the system gradually and are now starting to flourish.  You suggested that if a GM has a lot of returning players, they’re likely not doing enough for development— please correct me if I’ve misunderstood, but I strongly disagree with that premise.  The players I’m personally most proud of are my returning players who started last season with 50-65 TPE and are now almost completely capped.  They’ve learned how to earn weekly and consistently and are enjoying the reward of being dominant players in the VHLM after playing most of last season in depth roles.  Am I supposed to hurry them along so they can be low-level E players after 1 M season?  And it’s not like I haven’t been encouraging them to earn more— their update logs will prove that— but I won’t do so at the expense of their fun.

It seems to me that the best/ideal M GM will find a way to balance winning and teaching.  I don’t see these as competing interests at all, but actually mutually enriching! Winning is fun and can be a great way to motivate new players to earn and invest more in the league.  Getting players earning and having fun will also lend itself to winning.  Sure, you might lose players who earn their way out of the M in one season, but then maybe that’s where drafting and scouting have a part to play?

 

Anyways, have this as habit of writing too much sometimes and I need to stop.. I do appreciate this style of media spot though as it’s definitely thought provoking and an opportunity to reflect on the role we share as M GMs, so thank you for that!  I’d be happy to chat more, but if I misunderstood or misinterpreted any of your points, please let me know, that was not my intention!

 

Very well said.

 

I don't think it's fair to say that mediocre GMs win consistently. I do think there are cases in the VHLM though where you could have an, uh, "mediocre" GM outperform a great one over a few season span by virtue of some of the points laid out in the OP.

 

But I think what Lucy says here is bang on. If you are a great VHLM GM, then 1) you can probably find a way to combine both development and winning, 2) you will understand that ultimate goal is retention, which means prioritizing having fun, not just max earning. Some players will pick it up more slowly. Some will maybe not necessarily want to earn a ton right away. But if you can teach them about the league, create an active locker room environment, etc... then you're doing a great job. There's a lot of stuff in here that I can't really put better so I don't think I'll expand any further, but this is a great post overall.

 

Also, winning is fun. And so is playing and putting up good numbers. So this is another good point Lucy brings up in this post - "The players I’m personally most proud of are my returning players who started last season with 50-65 TPE and are now almost completely capped.  They’ve learned how to earn weekly and consistently and are enjoying the reward of being dominant players in the VHLM after playing most of last season in depth roles.  Am I supposed to hurry them along so they can be low-level E players after 1 M season?"

 

I think the VHLM may actually be the toughest place to be a GM because actually being a great VHLM GM requires finding and maintaining a balance that can be delicate sometimes. It can be a place where, over the short term, maybe doing your job well doesn't actually lead to winning or creates some disadvantages for you - and maybe doing your job just-okay does lead to winning or creates an advantage for you - but I think it's only true in the short run.

 

In the long run, the best GMs are the ones who can find that balance. And if you can do that, you will win - maybe not win Cups because only one team can do that every year and not a lot of people stay VHLM GMs for a super long time - but you will put together competitive teams on a consistent basis, for sure.

 

And although your job is to develop and teach, but don't underestimate the ability of a good team to keep people around. You can be the best teacher here but you need people willing to listen and if I were a first-gen drafted onto a team that didn't look very promising, it would actually be kind of discouraging - whereas I know for a fact S75 Miami going on a run shortly after I joined helped suck a lot of us into the league. Winning will 100% help get people more interested in the stuff you have to teach. But I mean... yes, absolutely, the priority has to be on having fun, retaining players, and teaching them about the league over just doing whatever will win the team more games. I do completely agree with that.

Edited June 10 by tcookie

[JCarson 723]

Everyone keeps suggesting that I believe every player needs to max earn.  That is not what i am saying.  Let me use a real example and maybe people will see how little I am asking of players and GM.  Marty Flowers, 1st Generation player joined the league week of June 9 as per his forum information.  He received Base TPE of 72.  There are 3 weeks left in this seasons sims, 2 weeks for playoffs and what will be 2 weeks of offseason.  That means 7 weeks before they enter the draft.  Let's assume they only get welfare and practice facility during that time. SO 6 points X 7 weeks is 42 more TPE.  Meaning on draft day they will have 114TPE.  So for that player to exit the VHLM within one full season needs to get 86 TPE, with 10 weeks for a season that is 8.6 TPE/week.  Now this isn't exactly true because the drafting GM should get the first gen bonus (Store 5TPE) and First Gen crossing 100 bonus (10TPE from Forum) for the player.  We are now down to 71TPE needed over 10 weeks.  So what the GM needs to do to meet my definition of a great GM is to help this player keep doing practice facility and welfare (60) and get 11 additional TPE.  Which if you can get them to write 1 media spot and claim the first gen doubles week would count for 12.  Or you work to do a few press conferences and a VHFL or 2.  All I am saying 11 points in 10 weeks is not asking for a lot.