Spartcast #6 - Into the Multi-verse

[Spartan 4,310]

 

Hey it's a fun Dr. Strange reference! Enjoy the shitty intro attempt using his theme, and I spent like 20 seconds editing it in so appreciate my effort. I will not entertain criticism.

 

Small warning that shit can get dark, I reference dark stuff that came up in conversations with Kachur/Horcrux

 

Mentions: @Shindigs (piggybacked on a rulebook related post of yours), @samx (briefly), @N0HBDY (decent amount), @fishy (really briefly but mod related stuff so figured you may want to listen) and Fong but he won't listen so won't tag.

 

Topics:

Multis

Moderation
Kachur/Horcrux

Rule visibility and enforcement domain (confusing, but hard to summarize into a topic list)

 

One week of claim if I even claim it.

 

Edit: I also sniffle a lot, it's cold, leave me alone

Edited December 28, 2021 by Spartan

[fishy 1,757]

where's the podcast

 

AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO CAN'T SEE IT

Edited December 28, 2021 by fishy

[N0HBDY 1,112]

That intro tho

[Spartan 4,310]

Also as a disclaimer so it doesn't get interpreted that way, not advocating for or claiming that conduct issues are more or less severe than cheating. Both are wrong. Both are unacceptable. We do need to maybe look at whether the solution to any issue, whether it's harassment, or making multis, is simply "you can't claim tpe for 3 or 4 weeks" with some sprinkles on top of either job loss if the offending person has a job or a temporary ban.

 

There should be a more representative punishment to the severity of the infraction, and vastly different infractions shouldn't receive the same punishment. Idk if I was clear in what I meant in the podcast (highly doubt it) but that's what I basically wanted to convey with more thought to the actual infraction. And also who is responsible for different aspects of the league's rules.

[fishy 1,757]

"i don't know why we have very similar punishments for very different situations"

the only similarity is length? TPE ban is much less severe than a suspension from forums and the discord

 

we left the CoC separate from the rule book because there's a chance that new players come in and, say, only read the VHLM rulebook. i personally think it's better practice to have the CoC separate, have its own tab in the "rules" dropdown, because it's far more visible. i also think that a link to the CoC should be included in the initial message that's sent to creates, but i also don't know what's currently in that message. CoC is at the very top of the "rules" list links, it's as visible as I think it can get

 

"i am utterly perfect" literally shut the fuck up

 

i'll do a podcast about emotional baiting with you

 

i am disappointed to have gotten to the end, listening to you talk about the intro and title

[Spartan 4,310]

9 minutes ago, fishy said:

the only similarity is length? TPE ban is much less severe than a suspension from forums and the discord

Maybe part of what I should have also conveyed is the diversity of punishments used. Probation for league positions, PT bans, removal of job pay, temporary hiring ban from league jobs - instead of using weeks of TPE bans and/or a forum/discord suspension. From my perspective, the severity of what AJ and Alexandre did were vastly different, but both got 3 weeks TPE ban and AJ may lose his job. That's more of my concern, keep suspending conduct offenders from the league, no issues with that.

 

9 minutes ago, fishy said:

i personally think it's better practice to have the CoC separate, have its own tab in the "rules" dropdown

Not advocating for it to not be its own post, but I think we need to make it more aware because I've seen a decent amount of "I didn't read the CoC because I'm not a dick" or versions of that. And I still question if cheating rules should be in CoC. 

 

9 minutes ago, fishy said:

i also think that a link to the CoC should be included in the initial message that's sent to creates, but i also don't know what's currently in that message.

absolutely, and same, idk what is in that welcome message and if its been updated at all recently - it should be though

 

9 minutes ago, fishy said:

i'll do a podcast about emotional baiting with you

not ominous at all, can we get a 3rd person to moderate?

 

9 minutes ago, fishy said:

"i am utterly perfect" literally shut the fuck up

Edited December 29, 2021 by Spartan

[Shindigs 1,771]

In this podcast: Spartan tells us that clickers aren't real people. (I mean to be fair a lot of them are multis, so not entirely untrue)

 

There are "competitive" games where you are allowed to use multiple accounts. It's usually in MMOs, sure. But the fact that exceptions do exist means you can't assume that everyone will just "know" that it's not allowed.

 

Agree that the multi rules need to be more clearly defined. Right now you have quite a lot of undefined cases. Which leads to a lot of confusion. I've had people be legitimately worried because their friend registered their account at their house, and wondering if that will get them in trouble. That can't possibly be against the rules, as doing that is literally in the best interest of the league, right? When a rule causes this much confusion, at some point you need to start shifting at least some blame from the rule breakers to the actual way the rule is written. Not because the rule breakers don't deserve blame, but because it needs to change to avoid history repeating itself. Figuring out who is right is pointless. Figuring out how to get the right result is what matters, and the current iteration of the rule is not getting the right result.

 

There was even more to the messed up pity farming of Kachur/Horcrux too. But since it's the only thing people have felt was too dark to leak, I guess I won't talk about it either.

[Spartan 4,310]

5 hours ago, Shindigs said:

I've had people be legitimately worried because their friend registered their account at their house, and wondering if that will get them in trouble. That can't possibly be against the rules

I feel like we have a shared IP thread for people in the same household to declare it when they create but I can't find it, so maybe I saw it in some other league. Maybe we need one of those now.

 

5 hours ago, Shindigs said:

But the fact that exceptions do exist means you can't assume that everyone will just "know" that it's not allowed.

So yeah, hence why the stuff relating to at the least, account creation, should be at the top of a rulebook that gets sent to a user at creation. Making an account is the first thing someone does when joining the league, seems only natural they learn the restrictions when it comes to what all you can do with accounts.

 

5 hours ago, Shindigs said:

There was even more to the messed up pity farming of Kachur/Horcrux too.

Yeah, think we can all agree Kachur was a fucked up dude and leave it at that.