Archetypes

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

Isn't it about time we got into it too? I mean instead of oh the 400 TPE guy with maybe a few 85's or the 1000 TPE guy with all 99's.

 

Maybe something similar to the ones the SHL has (obviously due to hockey terms.)

 

This makes it so that certain attributes get capped off, (could purchase uncapped capabilities in the store.)

 

Then people have to think what kind of player they want to be and it makes things more interesting.

[hedgehog337 3,483]

6 minutes ago, KGR said:

Maybe something similar to the ones the SHL has (obviously due to hockey terms.)

 

I guess it's on every league probably, like SBA, EFL, NSFL already have this as well.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

1 minute ago, hedgehog337 said:

 

I guess it's on every league probably, like SBA, EFL, NSFL already have this as well.

 

While it is, SHL came before all those and had it on there. I was referencing the names.

[jRuutu 2,464]

It´s time for sure. Bringing something like that in here would be great. With SHL the only real decision you need to make is if you want to hit or not. Eventually you will hit 90s and 99s in most categories. As some know, you have to pick 1 weakness, different class types have different strengths and weaknesses

 

Improving weakness is harder and majority will just put checking as weakness and that´s it, not a massive difference with players.  In Shl you also pick strenghts,  3 of those can go up to 99. Other stats are capped to 90.  Different class types have different strengths.

 

In here I would really like to see system where you need to pick 2 weaknesess or make the update scale just so hard that making multiple skills be at 99 is really tough.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

Absolutely not. No one should ever be told they can't put anything more into a skill. I'm all for differences in build, but the differences in build should be at the player's discretion.

 

I could get on board with something that said maybe "Until you get one stat to 85, you can only have 3 stats above 60" or something like that to influence making a player more specialized rather than balanced (and obviously more than one gate put up along the way, rather than just this one), where the individual gets to choose which skills in particular are upgraded as opposed to fitting into a cookie cutter mold, and that eventually everything can be unlocked (no permanent capping of a skill). If I want to build a guy that makes no sense, and put in scoring, puck handling, and checking with no defense, passing, and skating, I should be able to do so, even though there would never be an archetype built like that. I should then be able to fix that by adding more to a few other things, even if it requires unlocking them in some way. The biggest gripe I have is that you NEVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES should permanently cap a skill.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

2 minutes ago, jRuutu said:

It´s time for sure. Bringing something like that in here would be great. With SHL the only real decision you need to make is if you want to hit or not. Eventually you will hit 90s and 99s in most categories. As some know, you have to pick 1 weakness, different class types have different strengths and weaknesses

 

Improving weakness is harder and majority will just put checking as weakness and that´s it, not a massive difference with players.  In Shl you also pick strenghts,  3 of those can go up to 99. Other stats are capped to 90.  Different class types have different strengths.

 

In here I would really like to see system where you need to pick 2 weaknesess or make the update scale just so hard that making multiple skills be at 99 is really tough.

 

I'd agree. 2 weaknesses and 2 strengths to off-set the difference. Make it so the weaknesses cap at 80. Then you have 2 lows at 80, 2 maxed at 99 but the rest can only reach 90 as well.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

1 minute ago, diamond_ace said:

Absolutely not. No one should ever be told they can't put anything more into a skill. I'm all for differences in build, but the differences in build should be at the player's discretion.

 

I could get on board with something that said maybe "Until you get one stat to 85, you can only have 3 stats above 60" or something like that to influence making a player more specialized rather than balanced (and obviously more than one gate put up along the way, rather than just this one), where the individual gets to choose which skills in particular are upgraded as opposed to fitting into a cookie cutter mold, and that eventually everything can be unlocked (no permanent capping of a skill). If I want to build a guy that makes no sense, and put in scoring, puck handling, and checking with no defense, passing, and skating, I should be able to do so, even though there would never be an archetype built like that. I should then be able to fix that by adding more to a few other things, even if it requires unlocking them in some way. The biggest gripe I have is that you NEVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES should permanently cap a skill.

 

All the other league's are thriving on it. This way people have to build certain players and GM's have to strategically plan who to draft to fill their team's needs.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

Just now, KGR said:

 

All the other league's are thriving on it. This way people have to build certain players and GM's have to strategically plan who to draft to fill their team's needs.

There's a reason I only came back here and no other leagues.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

Just now, diamond_ace said:

There's a reason I only came back here and no other leagues.

 

Let's be honest, you as well as myself don't see you hitting those caps anyways. This is for those people who actually will get there.

[jRuutu 2,464]

Just now, KGR said:

 

I'd agree. 2 weaknesses and 2 strengths to off-set the difference. Make it so the weaknesses cap at 80. Then you have 2 lows at 80, 2 maxed at 99 but the rest can only reach 90 as well.

Something like that would be nice place to start and more than likely something that would be fairly easy to put in use.

 

VHL leaders should really think about this, not many leagues force people to do actually hard decisions with their players. Would be great way to bring hardcore users in.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

Just now, KGR said:

 

Let's be honest, you as well as myself don't see you hitting those caps anyways. This is for those people who actually will get there.

I don't know, I've already surprised myself with how much I've done since I came back. Nonetheless, are we doing voter suppression tactics in here? I am a member of the league, therefore I can have a role in discussing the issue, even if you want to silence me because I disagree with you.

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

The same result is done through the harsher update scale across the board. No need for archetypes as well. The reason they work so well in the SBA (the only other league I have knowledge of personally) is the number of relevant attributes.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

While we're on that particular topic, you'll retire and recreate before you hit the cap too, so I guess by your logic you don't get to discuss it either

[jRuutu 2,464]

5 minutes ago, diamond_ace said:

Absolutely not. No one should ever be told they can't put anything more into a skill. I'm all for differences in build, but the differences in build should be at the player's discretion.

 

I could get on board with something that said maybe "Until you get one stat to 85, you can only have 3 stats above 60" or something like that to influence making a player more specialized rather than balanced (and obviously more than one gate put up along the way, rather than just this one), where the individual gets to choose which skills in particular are upgraded as opposed to fitting into a cookie cutter mold, and that eventually everything can be unlocked (no permanent capping of a skill). If I want to build a guy that makes no sense, and put in scoring, puck handling, and checking with no defense, passing, and skating, I should be able to do so, even though there would never be an archetype built like that. I should then be able to fix that by adding more to a few other things, even if it requires unlocking them in some way. The biggest gripe I have is that you NEVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES should permanently cap a skill.

The thing is, you could still build a no sense player with ´weakness system´. For example I built fairly succesful player over in SHL that has scoring as weakness. Majority of my career it has been in 60´s.

 

If you want to go wild and build a player that cant skate at all, could just put skating as weakness?  If you later want to be able to skate little bit, you could still improve your skating, but the scale would be double or triple what it´s for other skills.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

1 minute ago, diamond_ace said:

I don't know, I've already surprised myself with how much I've done since I came back. Nonetheless, are we doing voter suppression tactics in here? I am a member of the league, therefore I can have a role in discussing the issue, even if you want to silence me because I disagree with you.

 

No suppression, just stating the facts. I mean they already changed the update scale.

 

1 minute ago, diamond_ace said:

While we're on that particular topic, you'll retire and recreate before you hit the cap too, so I guess by your logic you don't get to discuss it either

 

Oh so considering the fact that I have a few attributes that sit at 95 currently and could be 99 in a season means I will retire? Not sure what the personal jab meant. I was just saying your activity hasn't been the best and the player you are rolling the dice on, is already a few seasons deep. Unless you came back to full activity, I don't see you hitting it. No need for the personal shot here Jason.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

Just now, jRuutu said:

The thing is, you could still build a no sense player with ´weakness system´. For example I built fairly succesful player over in SHL that has scoring as weakness. Majority of my career it has been in 60´s.

 

If you want to go wild and build a player that cant skate at all, could just put skating as weakness?  If you later want to be able to skate little bit, you could still improve your skating, but the scale would be double or triple what it´s for other skills.

You can't really change your mind after the fact though, without completely working your ass off for months, and even then it's only to a certain point. If I built said player, then realized he was ass without skating, I'd be permanently stuck never getting him over 80 - even then, pouring loads and loads of TPE into him to even get to 80 - until I recreate.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

2 minutes ago, KGR said:

 

No suppression, just stating the facts. I mean they already changed the update scale.

 

 

Oh so considering the fact that I have a few attributes that sit at 95 currently and could be 99 in a season means I will retire? Not sure what the personal jab meant. I was just saying your activity hasn't been the best and the player you are rolling the dice on, is already a few seasons deep. Unless you came back to full activity, I don't see you hitting it. No need for the personal shot here Jason.

My primary point was that regardless of what you think of my activity, it has no bearing on the discussion at hand and is completely irrelevant as I'm still a member of the league and can discuss the issue on the same level as anyone else. You chose to bring up something irrelevant and a bit of a personal shot, so I did the same. It's not suddenly fine just because you're doing it, and then become a problem when I do it.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

Just now, diamond_ace said:

My primary point was that regardless of what you think of my activity, it has no bearing on the discussion at hand and is completely irrelevant as I'm still a member of the league and can discuss the issue on the same level as anyone else. You chose to bring up something irrelevant and a bit of a personal shot, so I did the same. It's not suddenly fine just because you're doing it, and then become a problem when I do it.

 

How was it personal? I'm just stating that with your current guy, he already is a few seasons in and at best would probably get 600ish TPE with maxing out each week. A fresh new player and full activity from you, yes I have seen what you can do. But you aren't that same person anymore I am just stating facts. If you want to take it as a personal shot, so be it. It was not sent out as that and won't be looked at like that.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

Just now, KGR said:

 

How was it personal? I'm just stating that with your current guy, he already is a few seasons in and at best would probably get 600ish TPE with maxing out each week. A fresh new player and full activity from you, yes I have seen what you can do. But you aren't that same person anymore I am just stating facts. If you want to take it as a personal shot, so be it. It was not sent out as that and won't be looked at like that.

If you commenting on my activity wasn't personal, then neither is my commenting on your penchant for retiring. It is absolutely a thing you do, "I am just stating facts"

[jRuutu 2,464]

1 minute ago, diamond_ace said:

You can't really change your mind after the fact though, without completely working your ass off for months, and even then it's only to a certain point. If I built said player, then realized he was ass without skating, I'd be permanently stuck never getting him over 80 - even then, pouring loads and loads of TPE into him to even get to 80 - until I recreate.

Skating as weakness is pretty bad idea or at least a challenging option, so I could see how you might regret it later But that does not still mean the build could not be fun, strong playmaking winger who cant skate at all, but is deadly in front of the net on PP? 

 

I don´t pretend that I have all the answers or ready idea that we could use, but I do agree with the fact that some kind of system where everybody is forced to truly choose what kind of player they want to be is really needed. Not many leagues truly have that

 

 

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

1 minute ago, diamond_ace said:

If you commenting on my activity wasn't personal, then neither is my commenting on your penchant for retiring. It is absolutely a thing you do, "I am just stating facts"

 

Whatever. Believe what you must to make you go through the day. All I know is that you would never reach that cap and I have no intention of retiring. So take your "activity" elsewhere or come up with a legit argument as to why not to do this.

[Beaviss 4,957]

Instead of having weakness and strengths to make the league have a larger variance of players. Get more people into the VHL so that not everyone will be scorers.

 

If teams have more then one line then they would be forced to have more then one type of player.

[diamond_ace 3,112]

2 minutes ago, KGR said:

 

Whatever. Believe what you must to make you go through the day. All I know is that you would never reach that cap and I have no intention of retiring. So take your "activity" elsewhere or come up with a legit argument as to why not to do this.

 

So you still refuse to believe that I have a right to discuss the topic?

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

I've been hearing the same bullshit about retiring from you and Kendrick for seasons. Quite frankly it gets hilarious that you actually say it. While you think it may bother me, (him too), it really doesn't. If I felt the need to retire one of my players this very second or in a couple seasons, that is on me. I will still recreate and not give a single fuck about what either of you think. I will still be drafted to a VHL team and team's will still value me as an active because it is what I am.

[Da Trifecta 1,896]

2 minutes ago, diamond_ace said:

 

So you still refuse to believe that I have a right to discuss the topic?

 

All I am asking for is for a legit reason as to why you think archetypes are bad. Instead of saying "no. i came back for one reason to this league and no other." How about argue why it's not such a good idea.