Beketov

F - Vaydar Odinsson I’m fine. Don’t think this is gonna be a very good season for me... anyway. @pennypenny

Well I’ve been here all this time so you could have come back to see me any time What brings you back buddy?

Welcome to the VHL, Kachur! We're happy to have you. You should have received a PM with some more detailed information, but to get started quickly you will want to head over to the "How to Create a Player" topic. That topic will offer you detailed information about how to use the VHL Portal to create your player and get you started. We also highly recommend joining the VHL Discord where there is a channel dedicated to helping new members with any questions that they may have about the league or improving their player. Once your player is made VHLM General Managers will be in touch with you about joining their teams. In the meantime, please feel free to ask any questions you have here or in your create-a-player thread. We're happy to have you in the community and we hope you stick around!

I mean you nailed it once, go out on top amirite?

I’ve never actually noticed because I don’t tend to look at VHLM games. Assuming @Higgins doesn’t find his way back tomorrow and I’m still simming I’ll try to remember to fix it.

What do you mean by copy them manually then? I don’t recall seeing this option but I might just be missing seeing it.

That’s exactly what I’m saying. Could also be because I’m using a newer version of STHS, might have been a bug that got fixed. So far as my testing can tell lines set will remain the same unless I tell them to change. Worst case, like you said, it will affect everyone evenly.

Maybe but for the WJC most GM’s didn’t even use the client, they just PMed me lines.

That doesn’t sound right though, unless everyone has fucked up lines the entire WC and World Juniors. I had teams where I literally set the lines once and left them, they didn’t go back to default. Might just be a client side thing. Or I’m just completely out of my mind.

If I’m not mistaken it’s less copying and more just leaving them eh? Like lines don’t change unless they are set to change.

Welcome to the VHL, Jon! We're happy to have you. You should have received a PM with some more detailed information, but to get started quickly you will want to head over to the "How to Create a Player" topic. That topic will offer you detailed information about how to use the VHL Portal to create your player and get you started. We also highly recommend joining the VHL Discord where there is a channel dedicated to helping new members with any questions that they may have about the league or improving their player. Once your player is made VHLM General Managers will be in touch with you about joining their teams. In the meantime, please feel free to ask any questions you have here or in your create-a-player thread. We're happy to have you in the community and we hope you stick around!

@Will is there a way to mass modify so all attributes drop by a certain percent so we can actually test this or will it involve manually editing every player?

This is the main issue though: I don’t think it would. Unless you’re talking ridiculously strict limits. Anyone with scoring in the 90’s is likely to score insane amounts so far as I can tell. If there’s a way to easily mass edit the players and we can really play around with the numbers maybe we can try but I don’t think having scoring go up to 90+ at all will work with V2 based on the kind of scoring numbers these tests show. At that point I feel like it’s artificially limiting too much for the sake of 2 statistics.

Yes, those guys have limitations but they are natural limitations they have learned to live with. I know your argument will be that we’ll learn to live with them as well which is true BUT these guys didn’t pick their limitations, we would. That means when one comes out as obviously better than the others (which one will for sure) then everyone will just use that one. So all those opportunities go out the window. There’s also the fact that our engine definitely rates certain things higher. For example a passer archetype would be tough because it rates scoring simply higher in the formula. I have roughly even assist and goal numbers while having 97 scoring and 40 passing. Probably could but it would have to be a pretty hefty percent to keep the same scale. Up to 70 is still 1 TPE so even if we started people at 0 you’re adding 70 TPE per attribute to get to the sameengine breaking levels. In the grand scheme of things that’s not much to still likely have the same problem. We also have to question at what point we lose the league’s identity of sorts for the sake of 2 statistics.

F - Otto Axelsson @street

You just saw the test, it was massively failed? If there’s a way to do that second part without manually editing all the players I’ll try it but right now I don’t have time to manually edit 100 players. Also any messing with the scale will need to be done all around, not just at the high end. Otherwise players in their 6th and 7th seasons for example, who really SHOULD be better, will have basically the same stats as rookies. We should not get any closer to that then where we already are.

Welcome to the VHL, Pier-Luc Besner! We're happy to have you. You should have received a PM with some more detailed information, but to get started quickly you will want to head over to the "How to Create a Player" topic. That topic will offer you detailed information about how to use the VHL Portal to create your player and get you started. We also highly recommend joining the VHL Discord where there is a channel dedicated to helping new members with any questions that they may have about the league or improving their player. Once your player is made VHLM General Managers will be in touch with you about joining their teams. In the meantime, please feel free to ask any questions you have here or in your create-a-player thread. We're happy to have you in the community and we hope you stick around!

My question will remain: is a major change like that worth it? From what I understand V2 doesn’t add much except a few select attributes. Do we force a complete re-work of how the VHL functions for the sake of a couple of stats? There’s an argument to be made both ways but personally I think no. Those stats mean very little to me, I hardly deem them worthy of an overhaul of that scale. As far as archetypes specifically are concerned I have the same annoyance with them that I always have. I hate the idea that someone who works their ass off simply has artificial limitations put into them from the get-go. In addition, no matter how hard we try to balance things STHS remains STHS. There will always be stats that over-value the others which means there will always be archetypes that are better. I to k you’d find that after a season or two everyone would use the exact same ones and we’d be in the same position we are now so far as builds are concerned but with people more artificially limited in what they can do.

Slider wise, no. I’d need to check to get what can actually be affected but it’s just like goals, shots, penalties, fights, etc. I don’t believe saves is an option. As @Will pointed out the only real system I think that could get us regular numbers would be re-workin attributes somehow. I don’t see sliders coming even remotely close.

Guaranteed yes. Even the control sim with V1 has very high scoring so we can really only compare the V2 tests to the control, not more regular seasons, but even then it’s ridiculous. I think what it mostly boils down to is shooting percentages just being through the roof. No amount of tuning shots is gonna help if people are simply scoring on half the shots they take.

Alright, in case anyone was curious, I ran some initial tests. Again, sorry for having such shitty indexes but we can't quite figure that out. A few points to make here before I post these: 1. This is based off of last season's database, set up as a new season. So rosters might not be exactly the same but at least they stand the same between the two tests. 2. Obviously these contain no line changes or anything else of the sort. 3. This initial test involved changing absolutely no sliders or any other settings other than switching from V1 to V2. Sliders will be adjusted in fewer tests. Now then, let's get to the indexes. V1 Index V2 Index A few things of note here. Well first, it's a shame for me that we didn't have Shepherd on the Bears the entire season, holy shit I played well. Anyway, moving on from that. Obviously scoring is completely off the rails in V2. The V1 test had ridiculously high scoring but still was within relatively regular levels. However even with that high scoring it wasn't even close to V2 scoring. The 213 point scoring lead under V1 would have been 27th (675 led the league) in V2 scoring. The highest scoring team in V1 was the Bears with 358 Goals For (League average 234). In V2 the wranglers led the league with a mind-boggling 1333 (League average 687). So yeah, not that anyone figured we'd be able to do this with just changing the version but clearly V2 has some major scoring issues with our current league set up. So, let's change some sliders shall we? Slider changes I made were reducing goals to minimum and cutting the shots in half. V2 Index - New Sliders Okay, so definitely better but still very high scoring. 422 points led the league and V1's leader would have been 14th. The wranglers once again led the league with 916 GF (League average 472) which is still a good chunk above double the highest scoring team under V1. I don't have time right now to mess with attributes but it's definitely not something that can be handled with Sliders alone. The main problem being that scoring numbers are simply FAR too high with league leaders scoring on over 50% of their shots in V2.

You’re telling me. 7 goals and I only get 1 assist? Da fuq.

G - Ismond Kingfisher @pennypenny is up after me but I believe @Philliefan still has a pick as well.

Welcome to the VHL, FlyersLord29! We're happy to have you. You should have received a PM with some more detailed information, but to get started quickly you will want to head over to the "How to Create a Player" topic. That topic will offer you detailed information about how to use the VHL Portal to create your player and get you started. We also highly recommend joining the VHL Discord where there is a channel dedicated to helping new members with any questions that they may have about the league or improving their player. Once your player is made VHLM General Managers will be in touch with you about joining their teams. In the meantime, please feel free to ask any questions you have here or in your create-a-player thread. We're happy to have you in the community and we hope you stick around!