It's all automated?!

[Peace 1,542]

So I've just recreated my fourth player and was awaiting pitches on the creation page for the better part of twenty minutes or so before loosing interest and switching to writing a draft media spot; is everything automated these days, are the portal pitches just a wall of text with an estimated line position? 

 

I was expected pitches in the profile page, but have just discovered all the pitches are done on the portal, and they don't even seem individualized... they seem computed, taking the average wingers on the team and spitting out a line based on that number. What happened to the days where VHLM GM's went to each and every profile with an actual pitch? "Hey there, I'm Peace, GM of the Saskatoon Wild..." or "Howdy, I'm the GM of the Wild!", you maybe even threw in a "Welcome to the league, I'm Peace..." every once in a while.

You'd then describe the situation of your team: "The Wild are kicking ass in S69 and don't have a lot of minutes available, but we've got a third line spot for you if you're interested" to "We suck ass right now and can offer you first line minutes immediately over the inactive bum we got there right now" and anything in between. It was part of the charm, part of what made being the first point of contact for a new member so interesting. Coupled with a pitch on the player page, I've got pages upon pages of 'Welcome to the Wild/Welcome to Saskatoon/Welcome to the Wilderness' PMs thanking them for accepting the pitch and offering them a link to the DLR.

 

I remember copy and pasting those beginning introductions sure, but each pitch had a hint of individualism behind it as you recapped your situation and what you could do for a new member. You made the effort.

 

Now it's boring. 

 

Boo!

Edited November 13 by Peace

[jacobcarson877 2,546]

Definitely more boring, but definitely safer for our mental health.

 

I used to be sitting on the Create a Player page while hanging out with my friends so I could be the first one to pitch. I got a ton of waivers, but it was brutal.

I wish there was a better middle ground, but this is certainly better for keeping GMs

[Peace 1,542]

6 minutes ago, jacobcarson877 said:

Definitely more boring, but definitely safer for our mental health.

 

I used to be sitting on the Create a Player page while hanging out with my friends so I could be the first one to pitch. I got a ton of waivers, but it was brutal.

I wish there was a better middle ground, but this is certainly better for keeping GMs

 

I never really thought it was a mental health issue, so that's a new perspective.

 

I suppose even back in the mid S60's when I managed the Wild VHLM GM's would be irritated that the first pitch was usually the one accepted, which occasionally led to a GM stepping down. It's too early for me to start throwing recommendations out but my old soul certainly feels like there should be a middle ground. There's zero personality and that's a net negative in my opinion; it comes to me as a repellent. I still haven't joined a team yet.

[mattyIceman 1,216]

I'd offer on your player, but I don't want to get fired...

 

Again

[Triller 1,670]

42 minutes ago, Peace said:

So I've just recreated my fourth player and was awaiting pitches on the creation page for the better part of twenty minutes or so before loosing interest and switching to writing a draft media spot; is everything automated these days, are the portal pitches just a wall of text with an estimated line position? 

 

I was expected pitches in the profile page, but have just discovered all the pitches are done on the portal, and they don't even seem individualized... they seem computed, taking the average wingers on the team and spitting out a line based on that number. What happened to the days where VHLM GM's went to each and every profile with an actual pitch? "Hey there, I'm Peace, GM of the Saskatoon Wild..." or "Howdy, I'm the GM of the Wild!", you maybe even threw in a "Welcome to the league, I'm Peace..." every once in a while.

You'd then describe the situation of your team: "The Wild are kicking ass in S69 and don't have a lot of minutes available, but we've got a third line spot for you if you're interested" to "We suck ass right now and can offer you first line minutes immediately over the inactive bum we got there right now" and anything in between. It was part of the charm, part of what made being the first point of contact for a new member so interesting. Coupled with a pitch on the player page, I've got pages upon pages of 'Welcome to the Wild/Welcome to Saskatoon/Welcome to the Wilderness' PMs thanking them for accepting the pitch and offering them a link to the DLR.

 

I remember copy and pasting those beginning introductions sure, but each pitch had a hint of individualism behind it as you recapped your situation and what you could do for a new member. You made the effort.

 

Now it's boring. 

 

Boo!

I only miss this because now that I've been here awhile and with what I have created, I could probably whip up a team intro video and some sweet graphics to go with it that may pull some new players in!  Would have been cool to see if it would have made a difference.

[Beketov 9,041]

Argue with @Gustav

 

For what it’s worth I distinctly recall 95% of pitch stuff being copy / paste with just changing out like a username basically and 99% of the time people just signed the first one they were offered so it basically led to GM’s burning themselves out trying to stay on top of recreates constantly.

 

Do I miss the pitches a bit? Yeah. I mean I tried to get GM’s to do it for me for fun before @Spartan decided fun wasn’t allowed but at the end of the day having them on the portal is definitely more fair and even. 

[Peace 1,542]

13 minutes ago, Beketov said:

Argue with @Gustav

 

For what it’s worth I distinctly recall 95% of pitch stuff being copy / paste with just changing out like a username basically and 99% of the time people just signed the first one they were offered so it basically led to GM’s burning themselves out trying to stay on top of recreates constantly.

 

Do I miss the pitches a bit? Yeah. I mean I tried to get GM’s to do it for me for fun before @Spartan decided fun wasn’t allowed but at the end of the day having them on the portal is definitely more fair and even. 

 

Most of them were but I'd like to think I made an effort to at least describe what was going on with Saskatoon, what I could offer and what not. 

[Beketov 9,041]

2 minutes ago, Peace said:

 

Most of them were but I'd like to think I made an effort to at least describe what was going on with Saskatoon, what I could offer and what not. 

Oh probably but the reality is that most weren’t that, especially in the time they had to churn them out.

[Gustav 6,436]

39 minutes ago, Peace said:

Most of them were but I'd like to think I made an effort to at least describe what was going on with Saskatoon, what I could offer and what not. 

Yeah I definitely did the same, but I say that as the one who pushed the current system. 
 

I have never said that it was perfect and I don’t disagree with anyone missing the personal element. It’s something we tried to mitigate by letting GMs customize the statement that comes with their offers on the portal. 
 

Along with making life easier for GMs (which was more crucial than some may realize during a time when we had issues attracting lots of high-quality candidates), there are some things it does to make the M more equitable. A team doesn’t have the choice to NOT make an offer (which I think we can agree was something too many were guilty of back in the day). It also serves the players by letting them pick whichever team situation they would like to be a part of while stopping GMs from misrepresenting how much someone would be used. 
 

We’re always open to suggestions for how to improve waivers. Having seen the way it works for a while, I really do like its benefits and would still take it over the way it used to be. The main (fair) complaint is about the personal aspect, and I’d be all for ways to increase that so long as it doesn’t mess with the other parts. 

[Daniel Janser 2,197]

As a former VHLM GM's in the 80s, I get your valid complaint. Pitching to waivers was at the time really a grind, as you wanted to be the first one to pitch, for reasons already mentioned by others. I would like to add a little twist to it as well. If not the first pitch was taken, a good graphic often helped. Luckily, back then, @Ricer13 was so kind to make one for my waiver pitches, and I am sure it got me the odd player I would not have gotten otherwise. 

 

Now it is more of a level playing field and GM's cannot exaggerate the roster situation to newcomers as much as back then (and I do not mean that it was done maliciously, some teams had no picks and almost no players in the roster, they had to sugarcoat their situation without outright lying in order to attract players). Also now you are given a 'pitch' for all the teams in the league and can make a decently informed decision what team you want to join. Back then maybe five teams were pitching, because competing teams with a roster of recreates would not like to 'water down' the TPE average by signing a first gen who would 'steal' time from the maxed players.

 

If I remember correctly, a rule was then implemented/in place that all teams had to pitch if they did not have a 'full roster' (I believe it was two lines and a netminder, but do not quote me on that). As you can imagine, such a rule is a b**ch to enforce and put unnecessary strain on GM's and Commishes alike (I for example come from the Central European time zone and it was not always possible to be on top of all the NA new-arrivals).

 

So, yeah I feel the nostalgia and do not disagree with you. I still think the current solution is more balanced and sustainable than what we had before. 

[LucyXpher 1,473]

Maybe this is just my groggy 8am cynical brain speaking, but I’m glad we have the current system and don’t have to pitch.  First, because it allows us to spend more time with real personal interactions with players who are actually on our teams without feeling like we need to chase down potential players.  And Secondly, because I feel like players have their preferred landing spots anyway and don’t even really care about pitches half the time.  
 

Anecdotally, when I joined, as soon as I saw my home city Houston had a team, I didn’t care that there were other options with more playing time.  I wanted to play there.  We also see a lot of recreates who have their preferences and teams they’d rather not play for.  Sure, pitching could be fun in an ideal world where nobody got cynical about the process, but as Jacob mentioned above, the prospect of waiting around to be the first in on a new player is way more trouble than it is worth.  I’d much rather spend my time as a GM working with and being the first point of contact for players who are actually on the team.  
 

I can only speak for myself, but I’ve tried my best to keep our team’s general pitch updated and specific so it doesn’t feel like a generic wall of text like you described.  But with a low word limit, there’s only so much you can say. But I do feel like those general pitches could use more love and attention— though in the flip side, it feels like hardly anyone reads them anyway, so…

[Agito 221]

I think there's just one drawback to this new system. While some may go with the place they prefer, others may simply rely on the ranking system that is introduced when the Waiver is selected. I've just come back and felt that way when choosing my selection. Although the system is nice. I don't think the ranking system is the best thing. A team could end up with a lot of players because it's #1 in the ranking while the 10th team is at the bottom. You come in and you don't necessarily want to be last in the standings. So you choose higher. But otherwise the system is great, despite the old system which could put pressure on GMs.

Edited November 13 by Agito

[STZ 5,363]

Nothing is real. We are all living in a simulation. Still waiting for VSN to crown NY the back-to-back-to-back VHL Champions.