Do pass first players work?

[Red 499]

I'm definitely not an expert when it comes to knowing what the fuck is going on with STHS, but I noticed something about a player on my team that I thought was pretty noteworthy and worth sharing. I read a post not long ago written by @GustavMattias about how to build your player and allocate your TPE. Somewhere in that article he explained the decision making formula  which is basically just a collection of attributes that determines your players decisions on the ice. These attributes are Skating, Scoring and Passing, if one attribute is higher than the others, than your player will more often decide to use that attribute when in possession of the puck. What you'll notice around the VHL and VHLM is that almost every player prefers to have scoring over everything else, which is because these greedy bitch's wanna score. And also because scorers tend to put up more points apparently. When I first learned about this I kind of just accepted it because I was naïve and just wanted to put up big numbers. Now though, after seeing a fellow teammate Mie Dickinson put up 17 points in 18 games while having a positive 10 plus/minus as a 72 TPE defensemen, I've started questioning whether a pass first player may be more effective than people think. What's important to note about Dickinson is that first, 15 of the points he's put up are assists and Second, he's one of the only players I've seen with a higher passing rating than scoring rating. If I were to come up with an idea of how he got all those points, it would be that he used his pass first mindset to find his greedy ass forwards who would always shoot the puck. If you think about it, having a defensemen who shoots more than he passes paired up with a bunch of forwards who also shoot more than they pass wouldn't be too effective. So basically my idea is that a pass first defensemen might be the strat. It would be really interesting to see if any new or returning players could try this to see if it works. Maybe someone has already tried this that I don't know about, who knows. Also this idea is really just for defensemen. I have no clue if this will ever work for a forward as I've never seen one have a higher passing rating than scoring rating.

401 words I think.

 

[Gustav 6,407]

There are a lot of pass-first defensemen. My first player (Jerry Garcia) spent his first six seasons as one and it didn't work. But that's not to say it flat-out doesn't--Joseph McWolf was pass-first and made the Hall of Fame, as a recent example.

 

You won't see someone pass-first on top of the points leaderboard in the VHL. Plain and simple. There's no real way around that and there very likely never will be. BUT--that's not to say that you or anybody else shouldn't make a pass-first player.

 

Ultimately, your player's build should always come down to how you want to build your player. Don't let anyone tell you it shouldn't. Some GMs, myself included, are fine with a pass-first player here and there--I wouldn't want the majority of my team going for a playmaker build, but I'd consider a few (even a forward or two) to be of value. Build variety can be important, and pass-first players can be of value to a team. They just generally won't be the ones winning the offensive awards.

[hedgehog337 3,483]

High TPE pass first defensemans are actually good players. Forwards wise - not great individual stats but good for team chemistry.

[Victor 10,940]

@Telkster has had a very solid career in Moscow as a pass first center and the team's never missed the playoffs with him.

[Beketov 9,025]

2 hours ago, hedgehog337 said:

Forwards wise - not great individual stats but good for team chemistry.

The only thing is that if they can find teams they do get that great chemistry with they can manage good individual numbers as well. See @Advantagein S68 when he was put with Thompson.

 

The tricky part is that a scoring focused player can do well mostly anywhere. A passing focused player needs the right linemates to succeed.

[Telkster 550]

As someone who has 99 passing, I think it depends a lot on line-mates. Without @VinCal there is probably no way I go slightly more then a ppg this year from the 2nd line. I bring the 99 passing and he brings the 98 scoring. Same thing happened when I played with Gritty. I may have only gotten 1 or 2 50-60 point seasons with gritty, but that doesn’t happen without him either.

[ThePerfectNut 563]

11 hours ago, RedSus said:

 I have no clue if this will ever work for a forward as I've never seen one have a higher passing rating than scoring rating.

401 words I think.

 

Ha ha ha...

[ThePerfectNut 563]

As the only god damn stupid member who actually use a passing build as a forward for his first two players.

I can say, if you are with the right players and team. You can get a point per game season, but it's extremely hard to get it and it does not happen a lot. You usually won't get a lot of points in the regular season on a good team too.

 

BUT!!!!

When it comes to the playoff, this is where his true nature arrives. My playmaking always had been a point per game (or near it) in the VHL and the VHLM when it did matter the most.


My proof?

Aleksander Rodriguez

He only made the playoff 3 times with all different teams.
He had 4 points in 6 games with Malmo on a bad year, 2 goals and 2 assist.

He had 18 points in 17 games with Seattle and won the cup which included 10 goals over 8 assist, which is weird for a passing build. With 4 game winning goals too.

Last year, 5 points in 6 games. 3 goals and 2 assist.

 

This gives him 27 points in 29 games which he has more goals than assist. Pretty good for a build that ain't supposed to put up points, but it does when it matters the most for some reason.

 

Luke Thornton (Current player)
He did not make the playoff yet in the VHL, but probably will in his rookie season.

 

VHLM: As usual, he did not put a lot of points in the VHLM regular season, but when it came to the playoff again. 

13 points in 15 game to go to the finals (Probably would had been a PPG if we were the winning team) which 5 of those are goals and 2 of the are game winning goals???

 

 

 

In conclusion

If you making a playmaking forward build. Don't expect to put up great numbers in the regular season except if you get one lucky good season, but when it comes to the playoff. They turn into fucking beast and score goals out of nowhere. Maybe @GustavMattiashas a reasoning for this weird occurence.

Edited October 18, 2020 by Jtv123

[Gustav 6,407]

45 minutes ago, Jtv123 said:

If you making a playmaking forward build. Don't expect to put up great numbers in the regular season except if you get one lucky good season, but when it comes to the playoff. They turn into fucking beast and score goals out of nowhere. Maybe @GustavMattiashas a reasoning for this weird occurence.

 

"I wish I understood STHS"

-every GM ever

[fromtheinside 1,290]

Now I'm second guessing myself haha. My plan is to make my defensemen an elite playmaker while also being a shut down Dman in his own end. 

[Gustav 6,407]

5 hours ago, fromtheinside said:

Now I'm second guessing myself haha. My plan is to make my defensemen an elite playmaker while also being a shut down Dman in his own end. 

 

Don't worry about it! Build how you want to build. Again, @McWolf made the Hall of Fame by doing that.