Spartan 4,531 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 As some of you have seen, VHFL rules were revamped yesterday after the S80 regular season concluded. If you haven't seen it yet, check it out here. For those of you new to the VHL, or new to VHFL, and don't know what VHFL is, it's basically the VHL's version of fantasy hockey. You get assigned groups of 6, who then draft teams of 3 forwards, 2 defensemen, and 1 goalie. The highest scoring team in a group receives 6 uncapped TPE, the lowest scoring team receives 1 TPE. You will always get at least 1 TPE! Anyways, the first and only time VHFL rules seem to have been touched was back in 2016, when the original VHFL rules post went up. It was pretty standard, describing the basic rules and scoring. Over time though, concerning trends have emerged, as many folks have covered over the seasons. There was a community fantasy suggestion thread that had some VHFL concerns and suggestions, a lovely post by @Berocka describing his thoughts on how he'd change VHFL, another community suggestion thread with VHFL suggestions buried in there, and also my own statistical breakdown of why I considered VHFL broken. I'm sure there are plenty more, those were just some of the most prominent ones I found when searching VHFL on forums and looking for suggestions/complaints. While the change is still pretty fresh and hasn't received a lot of attention, @GustavMattias had a brief post talking about the VHFL changes, and @Beketov chimed in a bit. As promised, I will break down all changes to VHFL, in order of how they're structured in the new rules post. --- Disclaimer: This is a somewhat lengthy post, but I have tried to make it as concise as possible without excluding relevant information. There is no TLDR. I have tried to organize it as best as I can, but Section 3 - Scoring is a behemoth. Lot of words, lot of stats. If you don't like lots of numbers, skip that part. --- Section 1 - Basic Structure No changes Section 2 - Payout Change: In some instances, listed in Section 4: Drafting, a user may receive 50% of their final payout. Payouts always round up to the nearest whole number. (Ex. 2.5 -> 3, 1.5 -> 2, 0.5 -> 1) Rationale: In S80, a couple situations popped up where users missed two picks and made appeals to avoid being completely disqualified, therefore losing out on any VHFL payout. We're participating in this community for fun, so it seems fair to try and accommodate users when the situation warrants it. For example, a user had an issue with both forum notification settings, and also being in a different time zone than most of his group. He missed two picks, but was allowed to continue for a 50% reduction in final pay. Another user missed the 12 hour window by minutes, and was prompt to respond when being skipped. Considering how well DQ teams end up doing since they get picked by the VHFL manager, this is probably a merciful change for everyone. Section 3 - Scoring Old Scoring: New Scoring: and So a lot has changed here. The graphs in the "Why VHFL is Broken" media spot show why these changes were necessary. Below is a sample graph. Point shares make up what % of each skater's (forward or defenseman) VHFL points were made up of hits and shots blocked. Hits were generally fine, in most cases, even a bit lower than expected. Hits generally making up under 25% of the top 20% of skaters seemed a bit low for me, answering @GustavMattias's question of why hits were increased from 0.2 to 0.3. Hits have never been problematic in VHFL, despite the claims being floated around that they were. (S78 Graph of Hit point share and SB point share vs total VHFL points) Shots blocked was the real issue. The entire cluster spanning 50%+ were defensemen. The entire cluster underneath 25% were forwards. Once again, forwards weren't being properly compensated for physical play, in a comprehensive manner. The forwards who were taking advantage of the high shot block value were the ones on the worst teams, which naturally surrender the most shot attempts against, therefore generating the most blocked shots. The overall fix was to stop treating forwards and defensemen the same. Their scoring has been split apart, as defensemen naturally log more blocked shots, and on average, more hits. Granted, the top "power forwards" will pace the league in hits, but they are outliers. The Groovy Doods, the Mikko Lahtinens, the Christian Mingles. Hits across the board were increased by 0.1 to try and bring the average point share a bit closer to 25%, to ensure we don't lose value on physical builds. Shots blocked were nerfed across the board, but most severely for defensemen who saw a reduction of 0.5 points per shot block, and forwards saw a reduction of 0.2. Keeping them at 0.8 was a bit too imbalanced for my liking. (S80 Graph of Hit point share and SB point share vs total VHFL points POST SCORING CHANGE) This was the result of the change, using S80 stats. Overall, the massive defenseman SB cluster has basically joined up with the forward SB cluster, and the overall average is in a bit better place that I'd prefer, hovering slightly under 25%. Hits also got some love, averaging more closely to 25% rather than the 15% range under old scoring. The section between 250 and 350 is especially cool to see, as the point share for hits and shots blocked varies tremendously. It is now possible to be a top VHFL player without having ridiculous amounts of hits and shots blocked, therefore busting the meta of targeting 1. physical point scorers and 2. average/decent players on bad teams. Another big change was to non-physical attributes. Defensemen now get more love for putting up points, with goals increasing to 3 points from 2, and assists to 1.5 from 1. Forwards don't see any change to goals, but receive a 0.3 increase to assists. Playmaker players seem to have been lost in the shuffle, as players with high assist numbers received no love. You're welcome @IHateBobNutting, assists matter too! However, I acknowledge that sometimes high assist numbers are a byproduct of forward linemates, therefore only a slight increase. Defensemen are largely driven by assists, and with the sharp reduction in shots blocked, it seemed fair to reward point scoring as well. This significantly increases the disparity between elite defensemen and average defensemen, making only 15 of the top 30 S80 VHFL players post-scoring change defensemen, wirth only 3 defensemen in the top 3. Woooooo, diversity in statistical groups! The impact is clear in the revised point share graph below, which combines hits and shot blocked point shares for skaters, essentially creating a measure of what percentage of a skater's VHFL points comes from their physical play. This shows that the two physical stats generally make up about 40% of a player's final VHFL score, with the top physical players reaching 50% or higher. Jared Carter, who put up 355 hits and 135 blocked shots in a dominant physical performance, while also scoring 9 goals and 65 assists has his physical performance rewarded with 65.97% of his total VHFL points coming from hits and blocked shots. Physicality is not dead! I think that was a brief concern I saw in Gus' post. (Combined Hit/SB point share vs total VHFL points POST SCORING CHANGE) The final change was the addition of the +/- attribute. I hate the +/- stat to measure a player's defensive aptitude, as there are plenty of factors as to why it's not an accurate stat to measure individual defensive capability. However, it is a TREMENDOUS measure to determine whether you are getting boosted by playing on a BAD team, or if your stats may be slightly reduced because you play on a really GOOD team. For example, two Toronto players in S80 got the #1 and #2 forward positions in VHFL despite being a combined -89. Yep. They were on the ice for a combined 89 more goals against than for. It's a clear impact of how STHS is forced to give points to the few competent players on openly tanking teams. Adding 0.2 points, or removing 0.2 points per total +/- helps negate that impact a little bit. Here is the best way I can show you the difference from the old scoring system to the new one - with the top 30 skaters under the old system vs the new one using S80 statistics. I'm sorry if the tables are messed up for you, I suppose you should just get a bigger screen. Or take my word for it. Old: Rank ID # Player Name POS G A HIT SB Total Points 1 25 Reylynn Reinhart D 27 75 268 183 329 2 19 R D 26 78 189 179 311 3 105 Hadrian D 15 45 291 213 303.6 4 65 Chicken Wing D 23 53 79 235 302.8 5 5 Asher Reinhart C 59 59 42 144 300.6 6 86 Zeedayno Chara D 25 43 256 195 300.2 7 18 Matty Socks D 29 75 172 157 293 8 39 Victor Grachev D 23 67 179 179 292 9 14 Jeffrey Pines D 25 83 49 183 289.2 10 6 Kristof Welch D 34 81 20 167 286.6 11 40 Kasper Kankkunen D 20 70 175 172 282.6 12 11 Duncan Idaho RW 54 56 365 43 271.4 13 41 Battre Sandstrom D 16 73 262 140 269.4 14 135 Rusty Knale D 9 32 311 195 268.2 15 36 Robin Galante Nilsson D 20 74 117 159 264.6 16 77 Jaromir Lemiuex RW 36 36 105 167 262.6 17 103 Sven Reikkinen D 27 34 36 209 262.4 18 73 Jared Carter C 9 65 355 135 262 19 42 Jiggly Gumballs D 9 79 242 144 260.6 20 71 Hard Markinson D 28 47 173 153 260 21 70 Tom Eagles D 24 51 201 151 260 22 4 Groovy Dood LW 61 59 279 28 259.2 23 78 Tui Sova D 22 50 158 165 257.6 24 94 Lucifer Olivier Leveque D 15 49 145 184 255.2 25 53 Aurelien Moreau D 8 74 250 141 252.8 26 17 That Dude C 40 66 330 47 249.6 27 16 Henry Tucker RW 47 59 369 28 249.2 28 60 Linus Zetterstrom D 13 65 59 183 249.2 29 3 Tyler Reinhart RW 63 63 156 36 249 30 82 Magnus Verlander LW 34 37 248 117 248.2 New: Rank ID # Player Name POS G A HIT SB +/- Total Points 1 25 Reylynn Reinhart D 27 75 268 183 28 334.4 2 11 Duncan Idaho RW 54 56 365 43 41 324.3 3 19 R D 26 78 189 179 77 320.8 4 4 Groovy Dood LW 61 59 279 28 41 307.4 5 16 Henry Tucker RW 47 59 369 28 37 305.6 6 18 Matty Socks D 29 75 172 157 37 305.6 7 35 John LeClair II LW 44 50 390 36 33 298.2 8 17 That Dude C 40 66 330 47 3 293.6 9 3 Tyler Reinhart RW 63 63 156 36 76 291.5 10 5 Asher Reinhart C 59 59 42 144 -19 289.9 11 6 Kristof Welch D 34 81 20 167 39 287.4 12 73 Jared Carter C 9 65 355 135 -29 284.2 13 10 Gunnar Odinsson RW 40 71 292 32 22 283.5 14 41 Battre Sandstrom D 16 73 262 140 17 281.5 15 39 Victor Grachev D 23 67 179 179 9 278.7 16 14 Jeffrey Pines D 25 83 49 183 44 277.9 17 1 Jivere Zolnek C 46 87 135 29 73 277.6 18 40 Kasper Kankkunen D 20 70 175 172 23 273.7 19 86 Zeedayno Chara D 25 43 256 195 -9 273 20 37 Christian Mingle C 35 56 327 44 28 272.9 21 42 Jiggly Gumballs D 9 79 242 144 40 269.3 22 8 Jerome Reinhart LW 47 67 161 39 76 268 23 13 Robert Bouchard C 46 63 182 48 27 262.7 24 71 Hard Markinson D 28 47 173 153 47 261.7 25 36 Robin Galante Nilsson D 20 74 117 159 38 261.4 26 70 Tom Eagles D 24 51 201 151 24 258.9 27 105 Hadrian D 15 45 291 213 -25 258.7 28 66 Phil The Rock Johnson RW 30 46 403 20 29 258.5 29 53 Aurelien Moreau D 8 74 250 141 7 253.7 30 82 Magnus Verlander LW 34 37 248 117 -36 253.5 Overall, scoring is a lot more balanced. The biggest takeaway here is that you now have to be more intentional with choosing defensemen. No longer can you afford to consistently wait until the 5th round to pick a defensemen who will probably land in the top 10. There are clear top forwards, and top defensemen. Identifying them will be more difficult, but picking offensive players, even those who lack physicality, is now viable. Oh and goalies were tweaked a bit. Wins are now 2 points instead of just 1, saves got increased to 0.1 each, but there is finally a penalty for goals against. No longer can you coast on volume alone. Old Top 10: Rank # Goalie Name W SO SA GA Fantasy Points 1 14 Trent Gibson 19 1 3231 269 231.34 2 2 Jean Pierre Camus 49 5 2445 159 234.02 3 1 Markus Emerson Jr 54 1 2563 185 225.46 4 10 Jacob Carson 32 1 2782 236 215.22 5 12 Thadius Sales 27 0 2577 232 191.15 6 5 Artem Tretiak 36 2 2384 181 200.21 7 7 Kunibuni UnGuri 33 1 2419 207 192.84 8 13 Tater Tot 25 1 2573 226 194.29 9 8 Grekkark Gyrfalcon 32 2 2338 207 191.17 10 11 Andrew Bowman 28 0 2724 243 201.67 New Top 10: Rank # Goalie Name W SO SA GA Fantasy Points 1 2 Jean Pierre Camus 49 5 2445 159 272.1 2 1 Markus Emerson Jr 54 1 2563 185 258.3 3 5 Artem Tretiak 36 2 2384 181 211.8 4 10 Jacob Carson 32 1 2782 236 205.6 5 14 Trent Gibson 19 1 3231 269 204.7 6 6 Sirkants Klamasteris 35 1 2344 176 203.8 7 3 Rara Rasputin 38 1 2136 172 191.4 8 7 Kunibuni UnGuri 33 1 2419 207 188.7 9 8 Grekkark Gyrfalcon 32 2 2338 207 183.6 10 4 Kevin Malone 36 2 2324 219 183 Wins are more likely to land a goalie at the top. However, to avoid just selecting the goalie with the best team in front of them, the volume stats (saves) are still included, albeit at a reduced amount. The GA penalty drops Trent Gibson from 1 to 5, and Thadius Sales completely off the board. Overall, there were a lot of changes to scoring, and I'm writing this at 1 AM so I doubt I've really explained it all super in depth. If you need more clarification on this section, I'd be happy to answer questions or provide more statistics in the comments. Section 4 - Drafting Changes: Rules were added to clean up the end of drafts. Rationale: There were situations where the final person to select in a draft could hold up a group from being finished, and there was no written rule or precedent to skip or disqualify that person/those people. Adding a 6 hour grace period from the final pick to get a group wrapped up clarifies that area, and also allows for partial payouts instead of a pure disqualification because shit happens. Reducing the amount of disqualifications is better for everyone. Section 5 - Group Managers Changes: Just about this entire section is new, and formally details the role of, expectations for, and the resulting compensation for group managers. There is also now a rule that group managers can have pay stripped for not properly managing their group. Rationale: Group manager is a position that receives 1 additional uncapped TPE just for helping the VHFL manager out. It's difficult to keep an eye on 20+ groups, so having group managers helps to keep groups moving between VHFL manager check-ins. However, it's also a popular role since you're guaranteed at least 2 TPE for being a group manager, with the 1 minimum for last place plus the 1 for managing a group. There are times where that generosity has been abused, and there has been no precedent to remove a group manager's pay for not doing their job. Now there are clear expectations, and it outlines what a group manager must try their best to do to receive GM pay. --- Conclusion So this piece is also well over 2k words, I apologize. I know this sort of stuff is difficult to get through, and I really appreciate anyone who has actually read all the way up to this point without just skipping down to here. If you did skip down here and have a specific question on the rules, feel free to leave a comment and I can answer it directly if you want a concise answer. I would love to hear feedback on these changes, but please recognize that these changes will be going into effect starting the S81 VHFL season. I am happy to answer questions, clarify any points of confusion, and respond to constructive feedback. I will give 0 shits about complaints about the changes outlined above without valid rationale. Thanks for reading Alex, Steve, Dom and 5 others 5 3 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berocka 2,263 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Imagine getting tagged and finding out all your wishes went unnoticed Spartan 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881383 Share on other sites More sharing options...
v.2 1,411 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Incredible work Spartan 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881384 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 27 minutes ago, Berocka said: Imagine getting tagged and finding out all your wishes went unnoticed So there is still some stuff pending that needs more fine tuning. I know time zones can hurt some people more than others, which was a root problem in your article. I've been thinking about potentially creating groups of people in similar timezones, or trying to set up a live draft on discord, almost like a NHL draft on Yahoo. Everyone shows up for 20-30 minutes to get it done. However, this is going to take more logistical planning than I've barely begun to approach, and better structuring in the sign up that I have yet to work on. I hope that at the least, the shift away from disqualifying users and more leeway for flexibility will be a temporary solution to your issue. I think we can make special allowances to people with valid time issues such as yourself without completely revamping how VHFL works. Berocka 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881386 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaikoku-hito 2,135 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 7 hours ago, Spartan said: So there is still some stuff pending that needs more fine tuning. I know time zones can hurt some people more than others, which was a root problem in your article. I've been thinking about potentially creating groups of people in similar timezones, or trying to set up a live draft on discord, almost like a NHL draft on Yahoo. Everyone shows up for 20-30 minutes to get it done. However, this is going to take more logistical planning than I've barely begun to approach, and better structuring in the sign up that I have yet to work on. I hope that at the least, the shift away from disqualifying users and more leeway for flexibility will be a temporary solution to your issue. I think we can make special allowances to people with valid time issues such as yourself without completely revamping how VHFL works. A solution to the time zones would be either shorten or lengthen the amount of time between picks. I am guessing length is better then shorten as it gives more time to users that are in a different time zone to respond. I know as I am one of those members and during VHFL; I have to baby sit my group if I am going to make my picks within the allotted 12 hrs since I am usually a sleep for 8 of those 12 hrs; meaning I actually only have about a 4 hour window when I awake to login and make my selection. That doesn`t always happen on weekends. So while I think the 12 hr window should be increased to 24 hrs; I also don`t want to see this either since it means the drafting will take way too long. Not a easy one to solve. Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881397 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 22 minutes ago, Gaikoku-hito said: A solution to the time zones would be either shorten or lengthen the amount of time between picks. I am guessing length is better then shorten as it gives more time to users that are in a different time zone to respond. I know as I am one of those members and during VHFL; I have to baby sit my group if I am going to make my picks within the allotted 12 hrs since I am usually a sleep for 8 of those 12 hrs; meaning I actually only have about a 4 hour window when I awake to login and make my selection. That doesn`t always happen on weekends. So while I think the 12 hr window should be increased to 24 hrs; I also don`t want to see this either since it means the drafting will take way too long. Not a easy one to solve. Yeah, in my opinion, this is one of the toughest areas to really fix. Most of the disqualifications last season came from members who weren't particularly active on forums in the first place. There were a couple of other more veteran users who got disqualified, for various reasons, some appealed and got a payout reduction. Last season was odd, because it was my first managing VHFL, so I had to balance a very late start to VHFL since there was no proper hire, and also following the rules and precedents. I wanted to get groups moving as quickly as possible, because I don't like when groups finish at very different times. Part of why I'm hesitant to make a large structural change is because out of 114 participants in S79, 5 were disqualified and 2 received reduced payouts. That's about 6% of participants who either got skipped, or would have gotten skipped if they didn't appeal. It's such a pretty low number that I have no plans to change pick lengths. People already try to make their group take as much time as possible with 12 hours, and that's also something that is on the list to try and disincentivize. Also - slight aside. How are people in the Eastern world consistently asleep during their pick? It's a 12 hour window, does it just work out that your 12 hour selection falls during your night time? I'd think that it's pretty variable since every pick isn't an exact 12 hours, therefore more variability in when your pick window starts. Then again, work/school also impacts how much time you have in a day to make a selection. I don't want to start VHFL before Free Agency opens, but I also don't want it going a week into the season. Need more suggestions on what could work! Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881401 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Ricer13 2,824 Posted October 28, 2021 Moderator Share Posted October 28, 2021 Can we just talk about how Reylynn Reinhart did so well this season JardyB10 and Spartan 1 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881404 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JardyB10 4,869 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 4 hours ago, Spartan said: Need more suggestions on what could work! Segregate the Euros into their own group. Perhaps at sign-up we also include our time zone, and that's how groups are determined. I suppose the potential drawback of this is that the Euros will always be in same or similar groupings, but that's my stab! Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881471 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 6 minutes ago, JardyB10 said: Segregate the Euros into their own group. Perhaps at sign-up we also include our time zone, and that's how groups are determined. I suppose the potential drawback of this is that the Euros will always be in same or similar groupings, but that's my stab! Yeah I was thinking about signing up with time zones, but I feel like it makes more sense to have more variability in time zones than to make each group's timezone homogeneous. Like a group of all east coasters will have school/work at the same time, will sleep at the same time. While aussies in a group with a euro lass and a east coaster would all be awake at different time. Someone want to do the research? Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881472 Share on other sites More sharing options...
JardyB10 4,869 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 13 minutes ago, Spartan said: Someone want to do the research? @BOOM isn't human and doesn't require sleep BOOM 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881473 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berocka 2,263 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 25 minutes ago, Spartan said: While aussies in a group with a euro lass and a east coaster would all be awake at different time. Someone want to do the research? The main problem is the "window of time" which people have to make the picks in their own lives. If anyone has a twelve hour period which they can't make picks then there is always a chance they miss picks. Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 50 minutes ago, Berocka said: The main problem is the "window of time" which people have to make the picks in their own lives. If anyone has a twelve hour period which they can't make picks then there is always a chance they miss picks. Right, and I think this is the main issue rather than time zones itself. I would only really have a window from 7 PM - midnight EST to make informed picks on weekdays. I have to monitor groups from my phone when at work. I don't think timezones would be the issue, which makes me circle back to the idea of a live, discord draft that would take like 30 minutes to complete. But that opens the whole different can of worms as to how to schedule those drafts, and how to get a group of 6 together. At the least, I could consider extending the window of time from 12 hours to 16 hours, or leaving it at 12 hours and making it 3 strikes for a DQ instead of 2. Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881493 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berocka 2,263 Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 What about a 12 hour window at the end of the group for people to make their picks Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881502 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 38 minutes ago, Berocka said: What about a 12 hour window at the end of the group for people to make their picks That's why I added a 6 hour window, to wrap up all pending picks. But that is capped out to 1 pick, or 2 with an appeal. We do need to keep groups moving and allowing a team to stash up 4 picks and make them all in the final 6/12 hour window would be unfair to the rest of the group. Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881511 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaikoku-hito 2,135 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 5 hours ago, Spartan said: which makes me circle back to the idea of a live, discord draft that would take like 30 minutes to complete. But that opens the whole different can of worms as to how to schedule those drafts, and how to get a group of 6 together. I don`t love the idea but I also don`t hate the idea!! LOL! I think you would still need to look at time zones if you are looking to do a live draft as it could still conflict with times that members might be available for the draft but that could be one way to determine groups; based on when available to complete the draft. Example: Group 1: Draft 7am EST on Oct 30th (First six to sign-up are allotted that group.) Assign Group Manager to run the draft Group 2: Draft 8am EST on Oct 30th etc.... Group 20: Draft 2am EST on Oct 31st I would play around with the timings but really the drafts should all be completed either in 24hr window or a 48 hr window. It means they are done quicker and should be easier on the VHFL manager? Spartan 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berocka 2,263 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 6 hours ago, Spartan said: That's why I added a 6 hour window, to wrap up all pending picks. But that is capped out to 1 pick, or 2 with an appeal. We do need to keep groups moving and allowing a team to stash up 4 picks and make them all in the final 6/12 hour window would be unfair to the rest of the group. Once someone misses two they have to pick at the end. How is it unfair if a team has all their picks at the end. All the good players should be gone Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881595 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 29, 2021 Author Share Posted October 29, 2021 1 minute ago, Berocka said: Once someone misses two they have to pick at the end. How is it unfair if a team has all their picks at the end. All the good players should be gone Because the first few rounds are generally selected before the season starts. The longer you wait, as people have tried to do for a while (extending pick lengths, holding off as long as possible to select), the more you get to see of how the season shapes up. No one was picking Henry Tucker last season until the season started. Allowing people to intentionally wait for longer into the season to make picks is unfair, and I will definitely not allow for a loophole to exist where people can wait to get a clearer picture over the rest of their group. 1 hour ago, Gaikoku-hito said: I don`t love the idea but I also don`t hate the idea!! LOL! I think you would still need to look at time zones if you are looking to do a live draft as it could still conflict with times that members might be available for the draft but that could be one way to determine groups; based on when available to complete the draft. Example: Group 1: Draft 7am EST on Oct 30th (First six to sign-up are allotted that group.) Assign Group Manager to run the draft Group 2: Draft 8am EST on Oct 30th etc.... Group 20: Draft 2am EST on Oct 31st I would play around with the timings but really the drafts should all be completed either in 24hr window or a 48 hr window. It means they are done quicker and should be easier on the VHFL manager? Yep, would have to be very attentive to time zones for a Discord draft. I'm still not convinced of this idea over adding a 3rd skip before disqualification, or extending pick lengths. Running Discord drafts feel like there could be too many loose ends, and logistical struggles than just having everything done in a single subforum. I'll keep an eye on this thread to see how other folks respond to the ideas as well, and keep thinking about how I'd like to prevent skips without incentivizing taking too long. Gaikoku-hito 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881596 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dasboot 521 Posted October 29, 2021 Share Posted October 29, 2021 Start the draft much sooner into off-season so most are done before the season starts Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881600 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,531 Posted October 29, 2021 Author Share Posted October 29, 2021 9 minutes ago, dasboot said: Start the draft much sooner into off-season so most are done before the season starts Only roadblock in that department is Free Agency. It opens up just a few days before the season starts, so there is a risk of starting too soon. However, I plan to start all VHFL drafts on the day FA opens, or the night before at least. Definitely don't want to start as late as last offseason! dasboot 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/110401-breaking-down-the-revamped-vhfl-rules/#findComment-881601 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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