Should there be AGMs in the VHLM?

[Enorama 2,038]

22 hours ago, GustavMattias said:

VHL AGMs are fairly pointless.

 

If you expect them to do the same thing a VHLM AGM does, absolutely. I've used @McWolf and @fonziGG as more of a second set of eyes to help me look over trades, draft selections, free agent signings, any future plans of any sort to make sure I didn't get swept up in negotiations or whatever and I didn't miss anything. That plus the obvious doing stuff now and then when real life gets in the way. I've missed half a draft in my time as GM and have needed one of them to send in lines for me once. I believe that's the only time I've really relegated my duties at all. 

 

I've also consistently forfeited the 1 pay I'm allowed to give them in recognition of how they help me. Although, to my knowledge, fonzi has never actually taken it.

 

TLDR; if an AGM is consistently taking over enough of the GM's duties that they really need pay, then the GM isn't doing their job and should be relieved of their duties. This is of course more prevalent at the VHLM level.

[McWolf 3,115]

Just now, Enorama said:

I've used @McWolf and @fonziGG

He used me and I loved it.

 

2 minutes ago, Enorama said:

I've also consistently forfeited the 1 pay I'm allowed to give them in recognition of how they help me. Although, to my knowledge, fonzi has never actually taken it.

I'm guilty of claiming the 1 TPE pay often, though to be fair, I'm fairly sure I would have capped without it anyway. It's just easier to claim job pay than waiting to do a task before claiming it.

[fonziGG 1,068]

15 minutes ago, Enorama said:

Although, to my knowledge, fonzi has never actually taken it.

I haven't cause it screws up my system of claiming. Granted, I really enjoy working with DC and don't feel like it's even a "job"!

[Bayley 419]

Are we thinking about AGMs all wrong? I think the point of AGMs is to develop someone that could be in a managerial position later on in the league. The goal is always to have a steady stream of GMs. Not that I think it's an issue here, what is the big deal of allowing someone to become a bigger member in the community as well as in the locker room? Allowing someone in to see what it looks like behind the scenes, giving them a taste of management can only do good things. 

 

Yes, can everything be done by 1 GM? Sure. But, that's not the point. The point is to have that person ready to take over if there was an open position. You give the person the chance and opportunity to show what they can bring to a team. I always loved bringing in @Viperxhawks19 as he had no experience in the GM area, so bringing him in would bring someone in that is dedicated to a position and would show that they can be a great GM. He learned how to use STHS, the portal, and everything else of what it means to be a GM in the VHL. I feel like that should be the purpose of a AGM. 

 

I go along with a lot of what @Sonnet said, but not necessarily to replace you, but to replace anyone. It's never a bad idea to have a steady stream of people who HAVE experience in being a GM. What better way to get experience than that of an AGM. 

[Viper 530]

3 minutes ago, Poptart said:

. I always loved bringing in @Viperxhawks19 as he had no experience in the GM area, so bringing him in would bring someone in that is dedicated to a position and would show that they can be a great GM. He learned how to use STHS, the portal, and everything else of what it means to be a GM in the VHL. I feel like that should be the purpose of a AGM.

[fonziGG 1,068]

1 hour ago, twists said:

 

Oh so I'm just some second class citizen that needs to bow down to my GM and treat him as a god then? Fuck right off with that shit

I think the tone of Poptarts message is what rubbed you the wrong way here.

 

When I got into management, I started off as the AGM of Halifax. I had originally thought I should get TPE for the role as well. As time went on, my opinion on this changed since I became a GM. I realized that I wanted my AGM's to truly soak in information in order for them to get a job as a GM.

 

I think what I'm trying to say here is that, if you want an AGM job, is that you should treat it as an internship. You really need to change your perspective if you want to be a successful GM. Look at everything your GM does and truly analyze it, good or bad and be prepared to do the opposite of the bad when you do become a GM. Learn the thought process and day to day processes that are positive and start thinking about processes you would have and suggest them. Ask questions to other GM's as well, specially former GM's and continue to question everything that ever happens and dissect why it did happen.

 

If you do all this (to all AGM's/aspiring AGM's) then I genuinely believe you'll become GM's and get paid properly.

 

 

Edited May 4, 2020 by fonziGG

[ShawnGlade 1,010]

1 hour ago, Doomsday said:

 

imagine not being over something that happened almost half a year ago

[Bayley 419]

7 minutes ago, fonziGG said:

I think the tone of Poptarts message is what rubbed you the wrong way here.

What tone?

[Doomsday 4,128]

9 minutes ago, Poptart said:

What tone?

 

I think he meant Sonnet. 

[Doomsday 4,128]

10 minutes ago, ShawnGlade said:

imagine not being over something that happened almost half a year ago

 

Says the guy whose Discord handle was, "Fuck the BoG," for the last half of a year until the very moment you needed their help. 

[Rayzor_7 741]

2 minutes ago, Doomsday said:

 

Says the guy whose Discord handle was, "Fuck the BoG," for the last half of a year until the very moment you needed their help. 

Just layoff man. He's doing his best to change so attacking him isn't helping. 

(Not condoning his actions here either but just chill a bit)

[McWolf 3,115]

If you guys are going to talk about if the AGMs of the league should be paid or not, I think we need to consider the fact GMing (and AGMing, for that matter) is what I'd consider a fun job. @Enorama and I talked about that in the past and we both thought that with the state of the league right now, and the number of people that want to GM, the position could be unpaid and there would still be loads of people fighting for the rights to do it. Do I believe it should be unpaid? No, of course, but my point is: It's unfair to compare the GM job pay to a regular point task (or to other jobs, for that matter) in terms of time invested or sentences written. I think most people here would not write PTs on a regular basis if they weren't paid, and no one would want to read through hundreds of update claims weekly for free.

 

The GM job is probably one of the jobs around the league that takes the most time on a weekly basis if you do it well. Especially down in the M, where you are constantly recruiting and helping newer members figure out what the hell the VHL is all about, but it pays in more ways than just TPE, in my opinion. There's a pride in seeing that some of your new players are motivated enough to write weekly PTs and are getting drafted in the VHL. There's a pride in building a competitive roster and seeing all of your players work together and celebrate wins in the LR. Again, I don't mean to say that GMs should be unpaid, but the fact that so many people want to do it and love doing it, compared to other jobs. It may sound mean, but if a GM out there is doing it 100% for the pay and not for thrill of it, it shouldn't be a GM in the first place. It's not what it's all about.

[Shaka 228]

Assistant GM's are exactly as valuable as each General Manager makes them. If you don't need one, cool. If you do, cool. If you want one, have one. I've been ran teams where I had like 4 people acting in one capacity or another for me. I've ran teams where I was the only guy.

 

That's the funny thing about sim leagues....

 

[ShawnGlade 1,010]

52 minutes ago, Doomsday said:

 

Says the guy whose Discord handle was, "Fuck the BoG," for the last half of a year until the very moment you needed their help. 

I changed my name and it was changed back, the fuck do you want me to do? Change my name 10 times a day? and not to mention it was 1 month, and i don't ever recall "needing their help" at any point. If you're gonna try and contribute to a discussion or try to be an asshole in every conversation you have with me, at the very least get your facts right

[Enorama 2,038]

45 minutes ago, Shaka said:

I've been ran teams

 

[Dil 1,760]

3 hours ago, twists said:

We also deserve rights!

What did I say about speaking out about your working conditions.

[fonziGG 1,068]

2 hours ago, Poptart said:

What tone?

Yeah sorry I’m fricken tired, I mean Sonnet

[Doomsday 4,128]

2 hours ago, Rayzor_7 said:

Just layoff man. He's doing his best to change so attacking him isn't helping. 

(Not condoning his actions here either but just chill a bit)

 

Yeah, I'm not seeing that at all.

 

1 hour ago, ShawnGlade said:

I changed my name and it was changed back, the fuck do you want me to do? Change my name 10 times a day? and not to mention it was 1 month, and i don't ever recall "needing their help" at any point. If you're gonna try and contribute to a discussion or try to be an asshole in every conversation you have with me, at the very least get your facts right

 

Tried that, you continued to be a sarcastic little shit in spite of me presenting a counterpoint to you. If you're so serious about changing like Rayzor says, act like it.

[ShawnGlade 1,010]

7 minutes ago, Doomsday said:

 

Yeah, I'm not seeing that at all.

 

 

Tried that, you continued to be a sarcastic little shit in spite of me presenting a counterpoint to you. If you're so serious about changing like Rayzor says, act like it.

Oh i am, you should see the stuff im doing its kinda cool. I'm just gonna need you to stop replying to every thread that the topic of management even comes up. At this point, you legitimately add nothing to the conversation, you do it just start shit, and you honestly cannot deny that. This happened almost 6 months ago, everyone has moved on apart from you. Nobody besides you ever brings it up, so it's your fucking fault we're even here. "Maybe if you made a list..." no fucking shit dumbass. I acknowledged it, you feel the need to circle back to it in every convo we have. So seriously, lay the fuck off. Nobody likes what you're doing

[Doomsday 4,128]

6 minutes ago, ShawnGlade said:

Oh i am, you should see the stuff im doing its kinda cool. I'm just gonna need you to stop replying to every thread that the topic of management even comes up. At this point, you legitimately add nothing to the conversation, you do it just start shit, and you honestly cannot deny that. This happened almost 6 months ago, everyone has moved on apart from you. Nobody besides you ever brings it up, so it's your fucking fault we're even here. "Maybe if you made a list..." no fucking shit dumbass. I acknowledged it, you feel the need to circle back to it in every convo we have. So seriously, lay the fuck off. Nobody likes what you're doing

 

No no no, look here. You're the one that says you're trying to change, yet you want to continue to act like a child. You want to act like AGMs aren't necessary even though you throw yourself at anyone who might be hiring one, yet I can't mention how one could have helped you? How you might still be in management instead of complaining about it. But, just like how you're blaming me right now for this, you don't want to listen to how decisions you made then harmed your management career here. Nothing is your fault in your eyes. 

 

The thing is, that's a terrible mindset to have. Everyone makes mistakes. You, me... everyone in this community. People who don't learn from their mistakes don't last long in management. Those who do, those who take mistakes they've made, learn from them, and better themselves... those are the people who succeed. Take some time and think about it. Learn from them! The sooner that learn that, the sooner you can begin to seriously change for the better.