VHLM and Recruitment are so bad right now

[Zetterberg 863]

Hello VHL, just wanted to rant about something real quick, I’m sure I’m not the first to talk about this and I’d hope that higher ups are aware of the issue but I feel it’s worth getting more attention. What is happening in the VHLM. Teams have no players! Like at all! Look at this!! 
 

 

How are these actual teams that are actually stepping on to the ice night after night?? That’s embarrassing. I get teams having 6-4-1 instead of the irl usual of 12-6-2. It’s sim hockey everyone wants some minutes but running a 2-1-1?!?! Or a 3-0-1?!?!?! 0 defenders on a hockey team…How is this supposed to encourage anyone on those teams to keep playing? And it’s not just Mexico and Halifax, Miami is running a 3-1-1, Mississauga is running a 4-2-1, Philly is running a 4-2-1. Hell the top team in the league rn Houston has 5 forwards and is about to lose one to IA.
 

The VHLM either needs to fold a bunch of teams next season or we fix the real problem and get recruitment to do something. Now I would like to say if you are apart of recruitment I don’t dislike you guys as members. But as the recruitment team you need to stop fucking around with reposting graphics that makes no sense to anyone outside the league on instagram and TikTok. Start doing what works. Get YouTube ads out, they bring in players every time and the majority of current members came from YouTube (me included). And get some better ideas for promotion I’m sorry but the instagram looks like garbage.
 

The image quality is all over the place the framing is even more all over the place. It looks sloppy and unprofessional. No one is gonna be drawn in to a post with Alex Letang in a Malmo Jersey with the name Reese McFleury plastered across his body. Cause it doesn’t make any sense to anyone outside of the vhl, which just so happens to be WHO YOU ARE ADVERTISING TO!! Like look at this post and tell me you aren’t going to instantly scroll by it.

 

Genuinely there’s maybe 3 posts where I’d imagine a normal person looks and doesn’t think “wtf” then keeps scrolling. 

 

Also probably the most important part do we even know if we’re allowed to be using NHL players to promote our site? Like it’s definitely okay to make stuff for the forum because it’s personal projects, but when it crosses into advertising I have to imagine that’s not allowed right? Like those are real people’s likenesses being used to promote the VHL without giving them financial compensation or getting consent.

 

It feels like recruitment has been bumbling around not putting any real effort or at least not coordinating a proper vision of how to promote the site. To end it, save the VHLM by getting a god damn YouTube ad out, and fix the sloppy mess that is the social media accounts. 

[rory 1,916]

EXPAND THE E BABY WOOOOOO

[Grape 679]

I have been told that Recruitment is working on a YouTube ad as we speak. If it falters, the complete removal of the E might be inevitable

[Ricer13 2,796]

Preach!

[dlamb 1,326]

[dlamb 1,326]

For real though, we could definitely use a script or video that we could just plaster everywhere. Even different Youtuber ad reads from what I remember are wildly different in how they explain what the VHL is.  

[Triller 1,663]

Nah, I won't bother with this.

[hylands 845]

personally i would love to have more players on my team

[samx 1,173]

I will say from the talks I've had with people in recruitment it is way harder now than it use to be. YouTubers have hiked up ad prices, the good old reddit posts most places don't allow anymore. There's also only so many times you can do a YouTube ad with the same people before you aren't reaching new audiences and this is a pretty niche thing. 

 

 

I agree things need to be done but it's a different scene then it used to be. Your not being helpful with this post but rather just complaining to complain when it's a known fact that we need more recruitment and they also know it.

[Zetterberg 863]

7 minutes ago, Triller said:

Nah, I won't bother with this.

Great idea! Instead continue to willingly violate privacy laws!!  

 

https://helensedwick.com/how-to-use-images-of-real-people-without-violating-privacy-and-publicity-rights/#:~:text=Using anyone's image for commercial,and non-commercial is fuzzy.

[McLovin 466]

I can say that as someone who works in the M as a GM, constantly trying to retain players, get them updating and interested in the league, the player drought right now would be just as bad for us as the rest of the league had I not twisted the arms of my friends and family to make players in the VHL. I don't agree with removing M teams, but I do agree with the statement that until a recruitment drive or something like removing the E and changing the TPE cap for M teams changes our situation, the M will continue to struggle immensely and something needs to be done soon. The M is meant to be a developmental league where players get their bearings and learn what they need to do to make good players to compete in the other leagues. When I can count on one hand how many active users are in M locker room discords ACROSS THE BOARD, not just in the small rostered teams, there is a MASSIVE problem that is being neglected. 

 

What's the point of having a developmental league if the only people we're developing are recreates and the odd new gen that's gonna leave the league once they are gone from the team they were recruited to? I'm not blaming the recruitment team solely for this issue, but a lot of the responsibility for this issue can be attributed to the fall from grace from where they used to be in their recruiting numbers back in the S60's & 70's and now. Get posting to reddit again, roll out YT ads, go door to door, literally anything except just reposting graphics from users and VSN on the league Instagram and Twitter.

[Zetterberg 863]

4 minutes ago, samx said:

I agree things need to be done but it's a different scene than it used to be. You’re not being helpful with this post but rather just complaining to complain when it's a known fact that we need more recruitment and they also know it.

 

look at this post and honestly tell me you think they’re trying their hardest…

 

All the ig is is grabbing community members posts throwing smoke effects over it and adding a caption. That’s great if they’re attempting a YouTube ad (even if it is months late) but it doesn’t change how boring and useless the instagram is or the fact that the M has no players when it’s recruitments job to get the players.

[Triller 1,663]

8 minutes ago, Zetterberg said:

Great idea! Instead continue to willingly violate privacy laws!!  

 

https://helensedwick.com/how-to-use-images-of-real-people-without-violating-privacy-and-publicity-rights/#:~:text=Using anyone's image for commercial,and non-commercial is fuzzy.

I'm the only one here who has some graphics that don't.  You're late to the party though, VHL has been advertising on Reddit for years using these graphics.  Didn't seem to be an issue then.  Someone to blame I guess or the automatic firing hit unintended targets?

[samx 1,173]

1 minute ago, Zetterberg said:

 

look at this post and honestly tell me you think they’re trying their hardest…

 

All the ig is is grabbing community members posts throwing smoke effects over it and adding a caption. That’s great if they’re attempting a YouTube ad (even if it is months late) but it doesn’t change how boring and useless the instagram is or the fact that the M has no players when it’s recruitments job to get the players.

 

I don't recall saying what they are doing is the best they can do but I'm also saying it's alot harder than during when we had those peak recruitment drives because times are

different. Giving them actual ideas is more helpful than just shitting on there work.

 

You can say throw a YouTube ad out but thats alot easier said than done. Youtbers that would actually get us decent recruitment prices are often unreasonable for a smallish forum community. 

 

Again I agree that something needs to change but shitting on people and their graphics isn't the way to go about it.

[Zetterberg 863]

7 minutes ago, samx said:

shitting on people and their graphics

Completely missed the point

[Zetterberg 863]

20 minutes ago, samx said:

Giving them actual ideas is more helpful than just shitting on there work.

Sure.. make instagram post that engages with the users and promotes the site for example.. VHL standing updates, stats races, trades, signings, or just look at what every other instagram hockey league account does. Or literally anything but poorly framed graphics (which is the one posting on instagrams fault not the graphics creators fault) that don’t mean anything to people who aren’t already in the VHL. Hell the pinned post isn’t even bad I like it, it’s what you want from that kind of account 

[tcookie 899]

  

1 hour ago, Zetterberg said:

No one is gonna be drawn in to a post with Alex Letang in a Malmo Jersey with the name Reese McFleury plastered across his body. Cause it doesn’t make any sense to anyone outside of the vhl, which just so happens to be WHO YOU ARE ADVERTISING TO!! Like look at this post and tell me you aren’t going to instantly scroll by it.

Genuinely there’s maybe 3 posts where I’d imagine a normal person looks and doesn’t think “wtf” then keeps scrolling. 

 

 

I think this is a super, super important point. If a post on there isn't interesting or meaningful to someone who has no idea what the VHL is, then it's not doing anything. This is an area I've personally done a lot of looking into over the last couple years and I still have a ton to learn but I'll try to share some thoughts that hopefully come across as helpful and not critical..

 

The pinned post on there is good - now I would probably prefer the wording "5 points to build your player" or something to "5 uncapped TPE" because the terminology "uncapped TPE" is sorta gibberish to someone just scrolling by, but you can definitely infer what "points to build your player" means & that it's a good thing, even if you don't know specifically how it works. I'd make that section more prominent as a reward that could draw someone in - but anyway, it's a good post with a lot of good information, promotes the league, tells people why they should be here.

 

But as Z said, a post with a Kris Letang jersey swap and the name Reese McFleury on it doesn't mean anything to anyone except the people that are already here. And that kind of thing is 90% of the Instagram. In addition to not making much sense to someone who isn't here, it also doesn't draw anyone in. Even if it looks cool, it doesn't really scream "there's a league here, check us out" - where stuff like standings, draft rankings, playoff/stats races do.

 

Put a call to action on the stuff that goes up there - just like a "this could be you!" on an award or championship graphic, or a "join the VHL // vhlforum.com" on something general, or something so that if something does catch someone's eye, they know there's a fantasy league & they immediately know how to check us out. It being in the description means they have to decide they want to read the description to get there. People don't get that far very often. That's another key point. If you really want people to see something, it shouldn't only be in the description.

Promote the players of standout first gens / new members especially, when you can - so that people don't feel like "oh they're 90 seasons in, how am I going to catch up in something that established anyway".

I don't have any specific ideas as far as engaging with users goes, but stuff that makes people want to interact & respond is huge... especially if you can get it to be of interest to non-VHL members & something they can contribute to.

[jacobcarson877 2,540]

47 minutes ago, Zetterberg said:

VHL standing updates, stats races, trades, signings, or just look at what every other instagram hockey league account does.

And who is making all of these professional grade graphics?

[twists 409]

[twists 409]

I will say though, everyone in this damn community is too afraid of hurting each others little feelings to actually improve anything. This has been a common issue since I've been here. If someone sucks at their job, this community lets them waste away at it until they "retire". Plus, once you get into a cushy gig like being on the recruitment team, no one wants to lose that job and they're all going to cover for each other.  

  

Wouldn't it be crazy if the more important league jobs (things involving real life) were merit based? Crazy idea I know.

[Zetterberg 863]

26 minutes ago, jacobcarson877 said:

And who is making all of these professional grade graphics?

The graphic designers on the recruitment team I’d assume. 
 

make them put in some effort for their tpe rather then take pre-made stuff from the community

Edited November 15, 2023 by Zetterberg

[jacobcarson877 2,540]

4 minutes ago, Zetterberg said:

The graphic designers on the recruitment team I’d assume. 
 

make them put in some effort for their tpe rather then take pre-made stuff from the community

So with daily posts (which I imagine would be the professional standard), plus on call posts for trades, signings and such, how many people can be reasonably expected to handle that volume of content? People get paid like real salaries to do this kind of work.

[McLovin 466]

16 minutes ago, jacobcarson877 said:

So with daily posts (which I imagine would be the professional standard), plus on call posts for trades, signings and such, how many people can be reasonably expected to handle that volume of content? People get paid like real salaries to do this kind of work.

Daily posts is wiiilldddd nobody is expecting that from the team, if it were a weekly thing that recruitment could use as job pay for their player then it's another story. With how VSN has to write 500+ words or a graphic a week for their 8 TPE, recruitment should have to do something similar in terms of getting word out there and getting people in. Have the graphic designers of the recruitment team make a real quick standings post which would literally take like 30 mins start to finish, submit that to the twitter and insta and claim their weekly TPE. Have the people who don't want to do graphics spend like 30 mins of their week just going around reddits or forums spreading the word, have them all collab on an ad and use some of the dono money to elevate the ad onto services that'll bring people in. There's plenty of solutions the recruitment team can do quickly and effectively, hell I managed to come up with those suggestions just in the span of writing this so there's no excuse as to why there isn't more effort going into getting people in. 

 

Lil edit here as well covering the second part of that post. It's much, MUCH easier to put a bunch of text onto a copy paste template for trades, signings, hell even score sheets than it is to make a player signature graphic from scratch. Again, 30 mins tops start to finish.

Edited November 15, 2023 by McLovin

[Zetterberg 863]

32 minutes ago, jacobcarson877 said:

So with daily posts (which I imagine would be the professional standard), plus on call posts for trades, signings and such, how many people can be reasonably expected to handle that volume of content? People get paid like real salaries to do this kind of work.

Yeah you can just look at what mclovin said, pretty much sums it up. I’m not sure why you want to go down this list of hypotheticals or why your seem to think I care about some strict professional standard. I just would like to see some more constructive effort from the recruitment team.

[Frank 5,212]