League Ideas

[hedgehog337 3,483]

2 minutes ago, boubabi said:

you mean 300 tpe scrubs that over performs for no reason ?

 

 

trash talk season is ON

 

For no reason? The sim luck is a valid reason you goof 

[jRuutu 2,475]

2 minutes ago, boubabi said:

because some people value the community and the board activity as a reason to stay. Welfare members usually do not contribute to the community life and or board 

This.

 

Just because some welfare players are active around the boards does not mean it´s a good system or working. Then again, if you are on welfare and active around the board, you more than likely could put together for example 500 word article each week, roughly 70 words a day, that is not much.

[boubabi 4,725]

I stil lthink we should encourage posting on the board as a way to earn tpe. I've proposed this before, and I stil lthink it's valid

 

Make it every 250 posts = x tpes

[Devise 4,475]

Welfare isn't going nowhere. Sorry but it isn't. It's a system that works best. If anything in the future we'll probably find alternatives to reward those who put in a lot more work. Again you guys focus on the wrong thing. It's so bloody typical.

 

You guys are like "activity is low! I got a genius idea, instead of rewarding the members that are more active let's punish those that aren't! That'll get more members to the league!" 

 

Most of this stuff has been discussed in the BoG, that of it that has merit anyway. But Welfare is not going. Your just going to have to live with that. 

[jRuutu 2,475]

9 minutes ago, boubabi said:

tanking is in the nature of the vhl. Wanting to reach for the 1st oa, or the best pick, is just the way to go to contend for a long time. CGY is actually victim of the fact that they never really tanked that good in recent seasons

You would not have to tank so heavily in a smaller league, changes are there is only so many scoring roles open in ´top´ teams and if there would be salary cap in place, the rebuilding team could more than likely be able to acquire solid players to help them in the rebuild more easily than now.

[hedgehog337 3,483]

1 minute ago, boubabi said:

I stil lthink we should encourage posting on the board as a way to earn tpe. I've proposed this before, and I stil lthink it's valid

 

Make it every 250 posts = x tpes

 

It requires a pointless spamming as well though. 

[Devise 4,475]

1 minute ago, boubabi said:

I stil lthink we should encourage posting on the board as a way to earn tpe. I've proposed this before, and I stil lthink it's valid

 

Make it every 250 posts = x tpes

 

We are already going to be doing that with a new switch remember? No more review team and people get TPE for essentially commenting on peoples PT's. If we do some sort of feature PT of the week, where we feature multiple PT's and put them in sections to generate better discussion/traffic I'd wager those who put in the work should be getting a bit more rewards over those that don't, and those that don't can still build decent to competent players for giving us their free time. 

[boubabi 4,725]

Just now, hedgehog337 said:

 

It requires a pointless spamming as well though. 

I don't care about pointless spamming. If someone takes to time to log in, make 250 pointless posts, still is 250 new posts

[boubabi 4,725]

Just now, Devise said:

 

We are already going to be doing that with a new switch remember? No more review team and people get TPE for essentially commenting on peoples PT's. If we do some sort of feature PT of the week, where we feature multiple PT's and put them in sections to generate better discussion/traffic I'd wager those who put in the work should be getting a bit more rewards over those that don't, and those that don't can still build decent to competent players for giving us their free time. 

The reviewing thing is different. Not everyone has the time/ motivation to write 250 reviews

 

sometimes, 250 posts about how shit the flyers are as much valuable to the league than 250 reviews

[Devise 4,475]

Just now, jRuutu said:

You would not have to tank so heavily in a smaller league, changes are there is only so many scoring roles open in ´top´ teams and if there would be salary cap in place, the rebuilding team could more than likely be able to acquire solid players to help them in the rebuild more easily than now.

 

Yes you would. This is a fallacy. It happened in the VHLM the same way. It's all about how something works in practice versus how it works on paper. On paper the reduction of teams leads to more balance. But you never account for how people react to the system. There will always be one team who realizes their chances of winning are limited, so they will make moves to "tank" or focus on getting better in a different season. Just as there will be one team with the opportunity to load up and create super teams. You get more parity from more players forced to be spread out among more teams, like we have now. The fact that you guys can't see the parity right now is insane to me. Helsinki just won back to back and then got ousted by both Davos and Riga this season in regards to success. New York before that won back to back then couldn't even make the finals following for two more seasons. We are what, one team shy of legit 6 playoff contenders? That is fine numbers. And Calgary is on the upswing anwyays so we are almost at 6 competitive teams here....in a league where 6 teams make the playoffs. That is fine. 

[jRuutu 2,475]

2 minutes ago, Devise said:

Welfare isn't going nowhere. Sorry but it isn't. It's a system that works best. If anything in the future we'll probably find alternatives to reward those who put in a lot more work. Again you guys focus on the wrong thing. It's so bloody typical.

 

You guys are like "activity is low! I got a genius idea, instead of rewarding the members that are more active let's punish those that aren't! That'll get more members to the league!" 

 

Most of this stuff has been discussed in the BoG, that of it that has merit anyway. But Welfare is not going. Your just going to have to live with that. 

You would not have to reward the ones who do a lot of work if the welfare system is not there. The user already did the work, in result he or she is going to have a great player. Now the welfare player is able to do almost the same, but with a lot less effort.

[boubabi 4,725]

3 minutes ago, Devise said:

Welfare isn't going nowhere. Sorry but it isn't. It's a system that works best. If anything in the future we'll probably find alternatives to reward those who put in a lot more work. Again you guys focus on the wrong thing. It's so bloody typical.

 

You guys are like "activity is low! I got a genius idea, instead of rewarding the members that are more active let's punish those that aren't! That'll get more members to the league!" 

 

Most of this stuff has been discussed in the BoG, that of it that has merit anyway. But Welfare is not going. Your just going to have to live with that. 

you know in the economy, when you are in a recession, the gov is spending MORE money is sometime the way to go to counter the recession ? Same thing here. Maybe it scares the welfare players, but it also encourages the one that do PT and motivates them to do a PT because there's no other alternative and laziness isn't accepted anymore. 

[Devise 4,475]

Just now, jRuutu said:

You would not have to reward the ones who do a lot of work if the welfare system is not there. The user already did the work, in result he or she is going to have a great player. Now the welfare player is able to do almost the same, but with a lot less effort.

 

What fucking year is it? Do you even know? Seriously how disconnected can you be from the world we live in and the times? Listen, someone who decides to show up here even for 2 hours a week to claim welfare, IS A BIG DEAL. Any free time anybody gives a sim league when free time is one of the most valuable commodities in 2017 is worthwhile. Period. It is. You do not attract new members by telling them how they have to engage with your league. That will never go anywhere. Which means the best way to work around a system that blankly rewards people for showing up is to properly compensate those that are doing the best work. It's 2 TPE per week these new members get for free. You need to get off this. WELFARE IS HERE TO SAY. Suck it up or leave the league over it I don't know what your problem is but any member who decides to come to the VHL to spend time here is valuable. Period. 

[hedgehog337 3,483]

1 minute ago, boubabi said:

but it also encourages the one that do PT and motivates them to do a PT because there's no other alternative and laziness isn't accepted anymore. 

 

Or a member can't find a time for a PT and then leaves the league because of that. Yes, that's the possible outcome too. 

[Devise 4,475]

1 minute ago, boubabi said:

you know in the economy, when you are in a recession, the gov is spending MORE money is sometime the way to go to counter the recession ? Same thing here. Maybe it scares the welfare players, but it also encourages the one that do PT and motivates them to do a PT because there's no other alternative and laziness isn't accepted anymore. 

 

I'm not saying we shouldn't reward the players who do PT's more. I'd advocated for an entire change of the PT system so that those who do more get the work. But there is a difference between rewarding those that do more more PT and in a world of free to play games where everyone gets rewarded for spending 10 minutes on something, saying there is no way for a member with that level of engagement to engage with our league in any time at all. It's just the truth. How many members or older timers have to step up and blankly say with no welfare they'd be gone before you guys realize it's for them and members like them? That doesn't mean you guys who do PT's shouldn't be building the best players and getting the most TPE. Ignore what TPE they earn, it has zero effect on the earners. Just earn, and if the reward scale is off, we should be finding ways or new systems to give you guys more. 

[jRuutu 2,475]

Just now, Devise said:

 

Yes you would. This is a fallacy. It happened in the VHLM the same way. It's all about how something works in practice versus how it works on paper. On paper the reduction of teams leads to more balance. But you never account for how people react to the system. There will always be one team who realizes their chances of winning are limited, so they will make moves to "tank" or focus on getting better in a different season. Just as there will be one team with the opportunity to load up and create super teams. You get more parity from more players forced to be spread out among more teams, like we have now. The fact that you guys can't see the parity right now is insane to me. Helsinki just won back to back and then got ousted by both Davos and Riga this season in regards to success. New York before that won back to back then couldn't even make the finals following for two more seasons. We are what, one team shy of legit 6 playoff contenders? That is fine numbers. And Calgary is on the upswing anwyays so we are almost at 6 competitive teams here....in a league where 6 teams make the playoffs. That is fine. 

VHLM is a different league though, in the best/ worst case scenario the active players are leaving in what, season or two when they get drafted? A lot easier to trade people away when you know they are gone soon anyways.

 

Make the salary cap more tighter in the small league and you really don´t have to tank so hard, because the top teams simply cant sign everybody.

 

[Devise 4,475]

1 minute ago, hedgehog337 said:

 

Or a member can't find a time for a PT and then leaves the league because of that. Yes, that's the possible outcome too. 

 

Tons of members have said they'd leave the league without welfare. It's a convenient fact overlooked by the minority of anti welfare people for no good reason. I don't even get why they focus or pay so much attention to it. The PT system is so fucking outdated anyways. It's been long overdue for a major systems overhaul to account for not only how members engage with this league, but also what a member who shows up every week and earns hard vs someone popping in with their limited free time to build a decent player earns. I'm not implying it is perfect right now I know it isn't. But removing welfare is never the answer. That is some members only method to engage with this league, it's simply suicide to remove it. And it's a dumb idea too. The amount of "member bias" going on in here and that does go on with the anti welfare minority bugs me. It's like they think we are saying welfare members are better for this league. We aren't. We are saying that everyone who has free tme and wants to engage with our league is welcome. That is how you attract all sorts of members, not just a 1% of people who want to do Graphics or Media spots. 

[Banackock 8,143]

If welfare = 5 TPE instead of 6, I'm just doing welfare. This is pretty much GOMHL at this point (acitivyt check). 

 

Those who put in work should be rewarded much higher than those who don't. If we agree on this, we can find a system.

 

 

[boubabi 4,725]

4 minutes ago, hedgehog337 said:

 

Or a member can't find a time for a PT and then leaves the league because of that. Yes, that's the possible outcome too. 

I don't like the ''can't find time''. Maybe if you're in north korea, I would understand. But everyone can find time for something they care. It just means that you used your time elsewhere in something you liked better, therefore you have to face the consequences of that decision.

[Banackock 8,143]

6 minutes ago, Devise said:

 

What fucking year is it? Do you even know? Seriously how disconnected can you be from the world we live in and the times? Listen, someone who decides to show up here even for 2 hours a week to claim welfare, IS A BIG DEAL. Any free time anybody gives a sim league when free time is one of the most valuable commodities in 2017 is worthwhile. Period. It is. You do not attract new members by telling them how they have to engage with your league. That will never go anywhere. Which means the best way to work around a system that blankly rewards people for showing up is to properly compensate those that are doing the best work. It's 2 TPE per week these new members get for free. You need to get off this. WELFARE IS HERE TO SAY. Suck it up or leave the league over it I don't know what your problem is but any member who decides to come to the VHL to spend time here is valuable. Period. 

Agreed though. All members are 100% equal and valued. 

 

We need to find a system where both are rewarded fairly. IMO, 4= welfare. Media spot = 6. (600 words is a fair amount). Lower it to 400???? If someone can do fuck all and claim 4? Why am I spending an hour writing a good article for 6? Right?

[boubabi 4,725]

2 minutes ago, Banackock said:

If welfare = 5 TPE instead of 6, I'm just doing welfare. This is pretty much GOMHL at this point (acitivyt check). 

 

Those who put in work should be rewarded much higher than those who don't. If we agree on this, we can find a system.

 

 

???????????????????????????

[hedgehog337 3,483]

Just now, boubabi said:

I don't like the ''can't find time''. Maybe if you're in north korea, I would understand. But everyone can find time for something they care. It just means that you used your time elsewhere in something you liked better, therefore you have to face the consequences of that decision.

 

IRL>virtual world though? 

 

I liked that 6+3 TPE from doing mock drafts and World Cup related PT's, so it could be nice if we can do this on a reglar basis. 

[Banackock 8,143]

At the end of the day, why the fuck would I write 600 words for 6 TPE when I could write 3 words for 4 tpe?

 

We need to find a balance to reward those who aren' as active and those who are.

 

In my eyes, we have a system that works for who are inactive. LEt's maybe find one for those who are. We aren't having an issue with inactivity, Maybe start rewarding people for being active.

[sterling 2,000]

5 minutes ago, boubabi said:

I don't like the ''can't find time''. Maybe if you're in north korea, I would understand. But everyone can find time for something they care. It just means that you used your time elsewhere in something you liked better, therefore you have to face the consequences of that decision.

Or there's some people that have been here for 10 years and find the point task system tedious...

[Gudnason 607]

Think equipment career was a thing back in the old days honestly.