Enorama and McWolf should be fired

[ColeMrtz 574]

On 9/16/2019 at 7:05 AM, jRuutu said:

Prague Panthers

also if you're going to write a flame article you could at least get the teams right

[Enorama 2,038]

11 minutes ago, Beaviss said:

 

I never rejected it he did...

 

5 minutes ago, Beaviss said:

 

Except im trying

 

42 minutes ago, Enorama said:

and spending the valuable assets that a certain GM has asked me for to help trim his roster doesn't do anything positive for my franchise down the line.

 

aka I won't make any fair value deal because it just doesn't make sense to me. Either I need to pay below market value, or you need to find another trade partner, but other teams are so full at this point that it's unlikely you find 'market value' anywhere else either. That basically means that market value across the board for selling players is sliding. 

 

Sorry for taking advantage of my situation for the betterment of my team's future ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ it's more or less the same thing you did with Shawn's cap situation.

[rjfryman 1,120]

54 minutes ago, .sniffuM said:

That's a lot of young players to deprive of achievement tracker TPE.

 

As a young, new member, would you rather score 15 points in the VHL for the worst team in the league or spend the year playing well in the VHLM and getting achievement tracker TPE (plus other stuff like VHLM fantasy zone and extra practice facility TPE)?

Not trying to say put players into the fire but I will say that since the achievement tracker is being phased out this won't be such an issue. also maybe the extra practice facility tpe should be based on tpe below 250? and not vhlm membership?

[Advantage 2,891]

11 minutes ago, Beaviss said:

 

Except im trying

That wasn't blame on anyone

[.sniffuM 1,741]

5 minutes ago, Enorama said:

 

 

 

aka I won't make any fair value deal because it just doesn't make sense to me. Either I need to pay below market value, or you need to find another trade partner, but other teams are so full at this point that it's unlikely you find 'market value' anywhere else either. That basically means that market value across the board for selling players is sliding. 

 

Sorry for taking advantage of my situation for the betterment of my team's future ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ it's more or less the same thing you did with Shawn's cap situation.

 

So what you're saying is, Beaviss asked for a 14th AND a 15th?

[.sniffuM 1,741]

3 minutes ago, rjfryman said:

Not trying to say put players into the fire but I will say that since the achievement tracker is being phased out this won't be such an issue. also maybe the extra practice facility tpe should be based on tpe below 250? and not vhlm membership?

 

Ahh right, forgot about that. But as you said there's the whole throwing them into the fire element to it too.

[Enorama 2,038]

32 minutes ago, Beaviss said:

 

I never rejected it he did...

 

Can't say this anymore either  

[McWolf 3,115]

i take full responsibility. Ban me for I have sinned.

[Beaviss 4,957]

2 minutes ago, Enorama said:

 

Can't say this anymore either  

A bad offer is not an offer in my eyes.

[Enorama 2,038]

2 minutes ago, Beaviss said:

A bad offer is not an offer in my eyes.

 

Ok, then you never gave me an offer to reject either

[Quik 4,113]

Nothing @Enorama has done is wrong. He has no obligation to acquire players from other teams, and is building for the future. Whether or not he is under-bidding on players, that's for him and other GMs to deal with, but as long as he is fielding a roster that meets minimum requirements, and not cutting active players for no reason, there's no issue with how he is handling his team.

[rjfryman 1,120]

30 minutes ago, .sniffuM said:

 

Ahh right, forgot about that. But as you said there's the whole throwing them into the fire element to it too.

No totally valid Im just trying to think of a middle ground between the two hot takes. One saying its horrible the other saying its all good. If we had practice tied to tpe then there would be no difference in growth wether you played in vhl/m. 

 

I do have to say from the court of public opinion since we don't know all the details we shouldn't really jump on them at all. If trades are unfair then they shouldn't be forced behind the 8 ball just to have more of a full roster. 

 

I do think there are things to talk about through this. like why do players stay in the vhlm an extra year if they can move up. I think it has to do with the vhlm tracker which im glad we are doing away with, and switching to just a bump at a certain threshold. Also we have an incentive from a money stand point to stay down to get extra bonus money, should that be a thing? Should that count towards the cap? I don't know the answer to these questions but I think they are better questions than is Enorama and Mcwolf (Fill in the blank)? 

 

[JeffD 648]

1 hour ago, frescoelmo said:

 

I reject your comment

 

Also when am I going to play

 

I have rights!!!!

Its gets even worse when you get called up. We had to form a defensemen's union on the Wolves.

[jRuutu 2,464]

1 hour ago, .sniffuM said:

 

So that the league doesn't need to scramble for a bigger expansion in the future. The S67 draft currently has 42 players over 200 TPE, S66 has 50. Across the old 10 teams that's over 9 players per team that, at worst, will be forced to play up by next season, from just 2 draft classes. That's why expansion was needed.

I see, what are you thoughts on D.C keeping their junior players down for this year even when they clearly could use players? At least few of those players are more than fine to play in VHL already, especially in a team like D.C.

[Quik 4,113]

5 minutes ago, jRuutu said:

I see, what are you thoughts on D.C keeping their junior players down for this year even when they clearly could use players? At least few of those players are more than fine to play in VHL already, especially in a team like D.C.

Only 2 of those are currently above 200 TPE. As nice as it would be to fill a roster with actives, there's no reason for DC to be calling up rookies that would not enjoy the experience of losing.

[jRuutu 2,464]

1 hour ago, Advantage said:

So you are saying a GM shouldnt ask a players opinion on decisions affecting his career and happiness in the league.

 

How is this being selfish? So his team sucks? It isnt hurting the league really..next year he will have most of his prospects and then from there on he will only get better.

 

He isnt even really gaining anything from "tanking" since the chances are equal of 1st pick no matter what so how is he selfish?

So everybody wants to play in a big role - correct? Now there are big roles on the table, but you say it´s not fair to expect players to play in those roles?

 

I mean if he is lucky to get 5 wins - that is hurting the league. Started the year with a bot goalie even when there was inactive 300+ TPE G available - not hurting the league?

 

1 hour ago, Advantage said:

I cant even imagine telling a player with like 100 tpe.  "I know you want to play in vhlm where you can perform well but instead I'm gonna give you top 6 minutes where you'll get wrecked." Like what an absolutely poor way to handle a member and player.

 

You consider their opinion and when a 100 tpe player wont really help you...your better off letting them develop where they can perform.

Don´t you see anything funny on the whole thing? Idea of playing in a 3rd or 4th line was seen as terrible thing by many, now there are nice big roles available, but instead of taking it - they play in the juniors. Even the poor D.C team now has players that are point per game, fair to say that young player could still play decent year in VHL when it comes down to points?

[jRuutu 2,464]

1 hour ago, Mr_Hatter said:

Also, expansion teams got (IMO) kinda screwed with their draft place. Like seriously, a team that literally has zero players or a bunch of surplus players from expansion draft has to draft after the champion? So it makes sense they have even less options. Not only did they have worse picks this year, but there was less incentive for other teams to try and grab their picks this year in exchange for more picks/players

I have to agree, would think they get the 1st and 2nd overalls automatically

[Enorama 2,038]

3 minutes ago, jRuutu said:

Started the year with a bot goalie even when there was inactive 300+ TPE G available - not hurting the league?

 

Inactive free agency was broken for a while. I made claims on Kingfisher and Nixon as soon as I was able.

 

Still though, I don't get how me playing or not playing an inactive over a bot hurts or hinders the league in any way.

[McWolf 3,115]

3 minutes ago, jRuutu said:

I mean if he is lucky to get 5 wins - that is hurting the league. Started the year with a bot goalie even when there was inactive 300+ TPE G available - not hurting the league?

 

inactive FA was broken in the offseason. We tried claiming Kingfish when it opened but Seattle got it first. We got Nixon now but yeah, really not our problem here.

[.sniffuM 1,741]

12 minutes ago, jRuutu said:

I see, what are you thoughts on D.C keeping their junior players down for this year even when they clearly could use players? At least few of those players are more than fine to play in VHL already, especially in a team like D.C.

 

I think it shakes out as I believe Eno said: better to leave the players down where they can enjoy themselves, and since it's clear DC won't make the playoffs whether or not they have inactives or bots, especially since it doesn't affect the draft lottery, it's fine.

[jRuutu 2,464]

1 hour ago, .sniffuM said:

 

It'd be pretty bad practice as a GM to be told by a player they want to stay down, only to tell them they're playing up anyways. You're setting them up to play worse in the pros than they would have in the minors and sacrifice as much as 30 TPE to do it.

 

In general nothing about modern VHL can be compared to anything before S63ish; the increase in depth of good players makes it a pointless comparison. As recently as S62 or whenever it was, Podrick Cast was able to put up one of the most dominant performances in a season with two digits in number, despite being around 500 TPE.

 

Players have also fought to stay down forever. Gorlab with his first player is a prominent example, but players have always sacrificed TPE to stay down. It may not have seemed as prominent in the 40s and 50s because of less players overall but it was happening.

 

Not only that, but the league recently put in a change to allow players to stay down with less than 250 TPE, raising the cap from 200. This is because as the league grows, the average TPE of pro players grows, and the effectiveness of lower TPE diminishes. So players staying down is something you'll see more often than you do now.

That is the price you pay for being lucky enough to end up into a expansion team though? You are going to play a lot and the results are not going to be that hot right away. Why is it so wrong to expect players to actually play?

 

Do you know about the SHL situation and their juniors? Players are now staying down so long that by the time they come up - they are so good that they can play in big roles. In the past you would play maybe 3 years? And then go up and play in 3rd line or 4th line, now players just kick it in the juniors. Some juniors teams are absolute stacked, the new players who join have to play in small roles in the juniors because of some just don´t want to come up even if they could play at decent level already, is that something that can happen here too?

 

 

[jRuutu 2,464]

1 hour ago, Rayzor_7 said:

This is some funny shit, I feel like this might just be a crack at Eno for no reason. Dude has done nothing wrong and everything right imo and clearly in the opinion of other members and GMs

As a D.C fan - I have every right to criticize the management and their handling of the team.

[jRuutu 2,464]

58 minutes ago, Quik said:

Nothing @Enorama has done is wrong. He has no obligation to acquire players from other teams, and is building for the future. Whether or not he is under-bidding on players, that's for him and other GMs to deal with, but as long as he is fielding a roster that meets minimum requirements, and not cutting active players for no reason, there's no issue with how he is handling his team.

What about starting the season with a bot goalie even when there was inactive ones available? What about the forwards, they could use couple players at least and there is inactive players out there?

 

18 minutes ago, Quik said:

Only 2 of those are currently above 200 TPE. As nice as it would be to fill a roster with actives, there's no reason for DC to be calling up rookies that would not enjoy the experience of losing.

And 2 others at 175+

 

Looking at their roster, I can see plenty of reason why those players should be up, but that is just me. Maybe those players like to play in smaller roles in the future, who knows.

[rjfryman 1,120]

6 minutes ago, jRuutu said:

Do you know about the SHL situation and their juniors? Players are now staying down so long that by the time they come up - they are so good that they can play in big roles. In the past you would play maybe 3 years? And then go up and play in 3rd line or 4th line, now players just kick it in the juniors. Some juniors teams are absolute stacked, the new players who join have to play in small roles in the juniors because of some just don´t want to come up even if they could play at decent level already, is that something that can happen here too?

 

So I agree with you that this could be a case study as to something could be wrong in the future and there are things that need to change. etc. etc. I don't like players staying down unless they would not hit the cap while trying, but we do have people who are staying the the vhlm when they could have moved up. I think that is something to discuss but I almost feel like some of this thread has been too much focused on Enorama and McWolf and this team. If take the people out of it and focus on the causes then it might be more productive and people would be less defensive. 

[STZ 5,358]

DC is just diggin their Grave(s)

Edited September 17, 2019 by STZ