Allow in Season Call Ups for Playoffs/Lottery Tourney

[Frank 5,057]

Right now there is no call up in-between leagues, which makes sense in itself as it would be hard for the VHLM and VHLE to build a roster if players were suddenly plucked mid season. While that makes sense, I think if a player is playing on a VHLM or VHLE team that misses the playoffs and is at or near 350+ tpe maybe allow the VHLE or VHL team that owns their rights to call them up for the playoffs (while not counting against the Salary Cap much like the NHL, i.e. Cale Makar called up to Colorado during the playoffs in 2019). This allows the player to get some minutes instead of the Pro Am being their only option and also rewards team for drafting well as it gives them more ammunition for a playoff run. The same principle would apply to the teams in the VHL lottery tournament. 

 

I doubt this will be approved but it's an interesting discussion point. @Josh @Beketov @rjfryman @Acydburn @McWolf  @diamond_ace

[ThePerfectNut 563]

I like the idea and it’s realistic 

[jacobcarson877 2,435]

Frank's getting bored and coming up with banger ideas.

[Arce 755]

I do recall when this was a thing. Every GM would call up from the farm because running these players on the 4th line/grit minutes made a difference. I would not be opposed to seeing it again, it adds excitement. It doesn’t negatively impact the E either as these players seasons would have ended anyway since they were not qualifying for the E playoffs.

[Gustav 6,322]

I agree with this! The only thing is that we'd have to figure out how it would affect depreciation (which I don't think it should since the player has zero regular season time). It also gives teams a very good reason to pay attention to their prospects, which is something that I've seen neglected once or twice.

 

In short, I like it. @BOG hi

[Beketov 8,941]

The main issue, and the reason the callup limit when it existed was set as the trade deadline, is STHS itself. Once it's in the playoffs you can't change rosters to add new players, it won't let you. So If we were to allow this we would need to make sure to provide a day between the regular season ending and the playoff index being created where GM's could see whether or not their prospects made the playoffs and if they didn't then call them up. Additionally once playoffs have started if a VHLE team gets eliminated the VHL team cannot then call up a new player.

 

Those aren't impossible rules to work around, just explaining the complication. It's more than just "we don't want to." Same reason that VHLM teams can't sign new players in the playoffs ultimately.

[Ricer13 2,776]

I think having that day between the season and playoffs makes sense. It’s easy enough to plan ahead and decide whether we want to call someone up. I like this idea and I think it’s worth a discussion in the BOG!

[N0HBDY 1,108]

Seems to be a reoccurring issue here, STHS can't handle it

[KaleebtheMighty 1,507]

I’m all for this! I think this would be a great idea to get a team’s prospects involved. And the extra day is completely fine in my book. I know it’s a little extra work to put into playoff rosters but it would feel pretty great for a prospect to get the nod to come help their VHL team make a playoff run.

[Spartan 4,276]

I think this idea is fine for the lottery tournament, not much so for the playoffs. Being able to call up your 350-400 capped players right before playoffs seems like working around cap loopholes to avoid running bots when the games matter most. For example Warsaw could have used this proposal to call up a defensemen to avoid running with WAR-D1, even though that bot seems to have the sim abilities of a HoFer. Teams could continue to adopt that sort of strategy and add more expensive players at the trade off of an incomplete roster only to call up the players they would have called up prior to the season but now before the postseason. EX. Moscow could have just not traded Idaho before this season and then called up Sogaard right before playoffs and we'd have a much higher TPA roster.

 

For the lotto tournament though where it's mostly for fun and the most at stake is a 5% shift in lotto odds, I think it'd be nice to call up prospects just for the experience. Maybe we allow lotto prospects that are called up to claim 1 experience like VHL players receive in the offseason. A miniscule perk (if you care about EX) for prospects on teams that are rebuilding/retooling.

Edited August 21, 2022 by Spartan

[dlamb 1,324]

4 minutes ago, Spartan said:

even though that bot seems to have the sim abilities of a HoFer

[rory 1,876]

Vhlm and vhle gms need to learn their role 

[v.2 1,381]

Better idea: get rid of the E

[Beketov 8,941]

8 hours ago, N0HBDY said:

Seems to be a reoccurring issue here, STHS can't handle it

Unless you have 15K lying around to build a new engine there’s not much we can do about that. STHS is far from perfect but it’s still the best option that’s available to us.

[Beketov 8,941]

6 hours ago, Spartan said:

Being able to call up your 350-400 capped players right before playoffs seems like working around cap loopholes to avoid running bot

I would think the team would still have to be cap compliant. Otherwise you’re just throwing the cap out the window for the playoffs and that’s not really reasonable at all. Like you said, keep the star power all season and as long as you make the playoffs you can load up the depth at that point.

[Frank 5,057]

In the NHL there is no salary cap in tye playoffs which allows teams to manipulate LTIR. My suggestion is along the same lines.

[Frank 5,057]

6 hours ago, Spartan said:

I think this idea is fine for the lottery tournament, not much so for the playoffs. Being able to call up your 350-400 capped players right before playoffs seems like working around cap loopholes to avoid running bots when the games matter most. For example Warsaw could have used this proposal to call up a defensemen to avoid running with WAR-D1, even though that bot seems to have the sim abilities of a HoFer. Teams could continue to adopt that sort of strategy and add more expensive players at the trade off of an incomplete roster only to call up the players they would have called up prior to the season but now before the postseason. EX. Moscow could have just not traded Idaho before this season and then called up Sogaard right before playoffs and we'd have a much higher TPA roster.

 

For the lotto tournament though where it's mostly for fun and the most at stake is a 5% shift in lotto odds, I think it'd be nice to call up prospects just for the experience. Maybe we allow lotto prospects that are called up to claim 1 experience like VHL players receive in the offseason. A miniscule perk (if you care about EX) for prospects on teams that are rebuilding/retooling.

I see nothing wrong with a team who drafts well taking advantage. In the current system 900 tpa players have almost negative value later in their careers which makes no sense. This is either a flaw in how cap is distributed or? 

[Spartan 4,276]

19 minutes ago, Frank said:

In the NHL there is no salary cap in tye playoffs which allows teams to manipulate LTIR. My suggestion is along the same lines.

If you want the cap manipulation then I'm pretty against it . It basically tosses out the majority of offseason/mid-season cap navigation with the expectation that your prospects will just fill out your roster in the playoffs.

 

32 minutes ago, Beketov said:

I would think the team would still have to be cap compliant. Otherwise you’re just throwing the cap out the window for the playoffs and that’s not really reasonable at all. Like you said, keep the star power all season and as long as you make the playoffs you can load up the depth at that point.

It'd really have to be discussed because I would assume there'd be a push for a discounted cap hit for the call-ups. At the already low-ish cap hit for 300-400 TPE players, I don't think they should be discounted. If we use the TDL hit of 60%, then those 300-400 TPE prospects on ELC's cost 900k. Teams could just spend up to the cap on stars minus 900k*however many playoff prospects. Sort of tosses out all the parity stuff we've been looking at recently for no real benefit outside "the NHL does it even though everyone hates how LTIR is abused"

 

12 minutes ago, Frank said:

I see nothing wrong with a team who drafts well taking advantage. In the current system 900 tpa players have almost negative value later in their careers which makes no sense. This is either a flaw in how cap is distributed or? 

I mean expensive players have had no value because parity sucked recently. When 3 teams have combined for 9 finals appearances in the last 5 seasons, there's a bit of an issue, which has already been helped out by hybrid changes. We've had some much better draft classes recently and there's been more player movement in the offseason as well, and standings are much more competitive.

 

BOG is also looking towards adjusting the future of the league towards hybrid players with 9 season careers. Also tweaking regression and revisiting salary brackets to make more sense with the hybrid system. So from my admittedly biased point of view on the BOG, I'd rather have formal fixes to make the cap work for everyone instead of intentionally creating a cap loophole that benefits teams a season or two into a rebuild when they have plenty of cap space for stars, assets for trades and prospects to call up before the playoffs.

Edited August 21, 2022 by Spartan

[Frank 5,057]

Main points are to offer players not playing more playing time. 

You could limit teams to 1 or 2 call ups depending if they're at or below the cap. 

The salary brackets definitely need updating of some kind.

[nurx 914]

I would to see if the league had more players instead of having more teams allow players to move up and down in the VHL/VHLE if course both GMs have to agree and it has to be a 1 for 1 trade. Like for example let's say a VHL team has a really strong offensive team, but has trouble defensively. They could take their 366 TPE center on the 3rd line and put him in the VHLE for a VHLE team that doesn't have food offense but does have good defense. This isn't an idea that could be implemented tomorrow or probably very soon, but I like the idea of GMs being able to move around players. Salary and rosters would have to have specific rules. Like trade deadline and roster locks are same day.