2016-2017 NHL Discussion

[Kendrick 4,741]

3 minutes ago, Victor said:

Brah I'm in this thread.

I tagged commish's.

[Devise 4,475]

4 minutes ago, Kendrick said:

1. @Draper @JardyB10 @Higgins Pin this.

 

2. Uh....Montreal got a hell of a player. A player who is better in their own end.

 

Eh. I believe Subban is the better player, especially for the make up of both rosters. Weber is slightly better in his own end. But PK is more of a dynamic game breaker, still can play physical and for a Nashville team who has the grit, size, structure and goaltending he is pretty much a missing piece for them imo.

 

I mean let's not forget about Josi, who a lot of people thought waz better than Weber defensively. 

[BeanSobie 91]

5 minutes ago, Mr. Power said:

Eh. I believe Subban is the better player, especially for the make up of both rosters. Weber is slightly better in his own end. But PK is more of a dynamic game breaker, still can play physical and for a Nashville team who has the grit, size, structure and goaltending he is pretty much a missing piece for them imo.

 

I mean let's not forget about Josi, who a lot of people thought waz better than Weber defensively. 

 

Subban better and younger.  People confuse being a risky offensive player with being a bad defensive player.  In his own zone with the puck off his stick Subban is no slouch.  I can't believe either of the trades today were one for ones, NJ and NSH clear winners.

[boubabi 4,725]

Subban isnt physical anymore tho

[Victor 10,968]

33 minutes ago, Kendrick said:

I tagged commish's.

You tagged Jardy.  

[Kendrick 4,741]

29 minutes ago, Mr. Power said:

 

Eh. I believe Subban is the better player, especially for the make up of both rosters. Weber is slightly better in his own end. But PK is more of a dynamic game breaker, still can play physical and for a Nashville team who has the grit, size, structure and goaltending he is pretty much a missing piece for them imo.

 

I mean let's not forget about Josi, who a lot of people thought waz better than Weber defensively. 

Slightly better? Weber would crush Subban in his own end 10 out of 10 times.

 

That's great he is a dynamic player, so was Kovalchuk in New Jersey but he also couldn't defend a rubber chicken if it learnt how to skate into the zone. Jose and Weber are equals defensively but Josi is better offensively. Maybe the east coast bias is working against Weber here.

[Kendrick 4,741]

1 minute ago, Victor said:

You tagged Jardy.  

Did someone replace him? I just tagged who I tagged, wgaf.

[Victor 10,968]

Just now, Kendrick said:

Did someone replace him? I just tagged who I tagged, wgaf.

No one. To both those questions. I'm just sayin'

[Kesler 1,514]

Oh god both Canadian teams lost in those trades  

 

Weber is good no doubt but his contract... And Larsson is at best a #3 d men on a team right now. Him for a proven first line winger who gets 30 on Edmonton lol. Edmonton must be really certain they are gonna get lucic then.

 

Also stammer resigns with tbay. 

 

The Canucks better be pitching hard to Eriksson.

[gregreg 930]

NHL lost it fucking mind today. 

Shocked Stamkos settled for what he did but he must really want that cup in TB.  

[Devise 4,475]

8 minutes ago, Kendrick said:

Slightly better? Weber would crush Subban in his own end 10 out of 10 times.

 

That's great he is a dynamic player, so was Kovalchuk in New Jersey but he also couldn't defend a rubber chicken if it learnt how to skate into the zone. Jose and Weber are equals defensively but Josi is better offensively. Maybe the east coast bias is working against Weber here.

 

Eh I think people tend to underrate Subbans defensive abilities. I feel like he has gotten a lot better in regards to decision making. I also think the big areas where Weber is better, shot blocking, positional play, stick work, get slightly undermined by the fact that more and more teams and players in the NHL are getting fast. There are more instances were having not just the decision making but speed to shadow and play one on one. Subban has the edges there just from pure athletic ability. But that is neither here nor there since I don't think one particular style of play defensively or approach is better or worse than the other. 

 

To me, why this is a bad deal for MTL is because both in terms of team need lack what Subban is. Weber is still a great player, however MTL is severely lacking those type of offensively dynamic game breakers that most competitors have. People forget that the LA's and Chicago's of the world have names like Kane and Doughty that help complete them, and combines with their solid two way tough gritty type players. Nashville was loaded with those type of players, and now with Forsberg, Johasen and Subban, they offer the dynamic option as well. It was pretty much exactly what Nashville needed. Where as I question what kind of impact Weber has on that MTL roster. They really needed to add a big name forward to go with Subban on that roster. No with Subban also gone, other than Price the amount of dynamic game breaking type players MTL has is pretty lacking. 

[boubabi 4,725]

Having Price in net is enough for me

 

[Higgins 3,618]

Guys....

 

Hertl at 6 mil for 2 years

[Fire Tortorella 2,653]

Thank the heavens Holmgren isn't the Flyers GM anymore after seeing these moves.

[James 77]

So many mixed emotions

[Knight 1,289]

3 hours ago, Mr. Power said:

 

Disagree completely. 

 

Crosby has 19 points in 24 games. 11 of those 19 games Crosby had 0 points. Which means he actually had 19 points in 8 games. His effectiveness wasn't also clutch in any department save for in that first series. Against the Caps he had 2 assists in six games. He was literally a non factor in determining anything in that series. Meanwhile, the ACTUAL MVP

 

Phil Kessel 22 points in 24 games. Kessel was only held off the scoresheet 8 times, he contributed offense on a more consistent basis that Crosby did, and was more involved in ever series. 

 

Crosby - 8 Points Against the Rangers (thats right, almost half his entire point total was gained in the first series.) 2 Points Against the Capitals, 5 Points Against TBL and 4 Against SJ. Despite the fact that the TBL and Caps series both went longer than 5 games, he really was only doing Conn Smyth level damage in that first round. The Capitals shut him down masterfully. TBL and SJ struggled a bit to shut him down, but kept him off the scoresheet a bunch. Crosby only had 1 game without a point after the first round, and had 10 more games without a point in the next 3 rounds. 

 

Kessel - 4 Points Against the Rangers in 5 games. 6 Points Against the Capitals in 6 games. 6 Points Against the Ligthning in 7 games. 4 Points Against the Sharks in 5 games. You see the consistency? 

 

Arguments can be made for other players too, like Murray who as a rookie had a .923 save percentage and a 2.08 goals against average. He stole games in critical series, and I know it may be "biased" but he certainly stole games against the Caps. Which is hilariously the series in which the "supposed" playoff MVP was essentially irrelevant. 2 assists in 6 games of a series is not what I'd call contributing. That doesn't even factor in other players, like from San Jose for example. I'm fine with it going to a Pitt player though, but Crosby had no business in any sense of the word winning that award. One good series, in the first round no less, shouldn't justify a MVP when the big factor why his team got passed Washington and got past Tampa had nothing to do with him. I mean how can you justify an argument for him as MVP when he had 8 points in 5 games against the Rangers, and then didn't compile another 8 points at all in the entire playoffs until he got to the finals. So he went from being able to pot 8 points in 5 games, to potting 8 points in like 12 more games. He was shut down so much in the playoffs, and other players on his own team were more consistent, and even had more total points. Where is the argument? It's called media bias, plain and simple. And this isn't a "I hate Crosby so fuck him." If he was deserving of the damn award I'd gladly see him raise it. He's simply not. 

 

3 GWG in the series against Tampa would be thought of clutch in most people's minds. 

 

Crosby played against tougher players than the Kessel line did. That was the beauty of rolling 3 great lines, you simply can't shut them all down. Solely basing your "Crosby is not deserving" on points is a tad disingenuous. 

 

Penguins to me were a great example of a "Team Victory." Granted, most teams who win the Stanley Cup are great teams. There's hardly ever a carry from a non-goalie like there can be in other sports like basketball, football, or baseball. There were many deserving candidates for the Conn Smythe. Kessel (who I personally would have given it to), Letang, Murray and Crosby were the consensus candidates. Any of those guys were deserving. Ultimately, it went to the captain who led his team to a Stanley Cup.

 

Crosby played with Hornqvuist and Sheary. Malkin with Kunitz and Rust. Kessel with Hagelin and Bonino. The talent was spread out. Of course it's bound to have an impact on Crosby's point totals. Same with Malkin. They play against top defenders with okay players. That's part of their skill set it to make those around them better. 

 

I don't mind arguments saying other players should have won. I think there are perfectly reasonable arguments in favour of that. To say he is not deserving though is definitely disingenuous. 

[Knight 1,289]

Any EDM or MON fans here? How absolutely seemingly brutal are those deals?

[Advantage 2,892]

19 minutes ago, Knight said:

Any EDM or MON fans here? How absolutely seemingly brutal are those deals?

Not thrilled right now.

[Dangles13 373]

3 hours ago, Kendrick said:

Its not a bad deal for my Devils, but it leaves a huge whole on our left side blueline. That and Taylor Hall is one of the biggest pussies in the league.

By pussy you mean what exactly?

 

I also thought Adam was right side?

Edited June 29, 2016 by Dangles13

[gorlab 4,321]

Damn, what a massive day for NHL trades/movement.

 

Canadian teams took L's all around tho IMO. Weber is definitely no slouch, I usually always try to draft him to my fantasy teams because he is pretty underrated for how good he is. Subban IMO is a tad overrated.

 

Hall for JUST Adam Larsson was a fail though. Should have gotten Larsson + picks/spects. 

[BeanSobie 91]

12 minutes ago, Dangles13 said:

I also thought Adam was right side?

 

He's right handed.  Devils had a ton of right handed D though, so he played on the left.  Oilers most likely targeted him in large part because of his handedness and wanting a Top Four right handed blueliner.  I think this year some study came out about the effectiveness of handiness between defensive pairings and I guess Edmonton really bought into it.

 

Edit: If you are into that kind of thing here's some hockey graphs

Edited June 29, 2016 by BeanSobie

[TheLastOlympian07 2,388]

2 minutes ago, BeanSobie said:

 

He's right handed.  Devils had a ton of right handed D though, so he played on the left.  Oilers most likely targeted him in large part because of his handedness and wanting a Top Four right handed blueliner.  I think this year some study came out about the effectiveness of handiness between defensive pairings and I guess Edmonton really bought into it.

you coming back to the VHL bb?

 

edit - i mean becoming a bit more active? 

Edited June 29, 2016 by TheLastOlympian07

[BeanSobie 91]

Just now, TheLastOlympian07 said:

you coming back to the VHL bb?

 

I'm right here lol, but yeah I'm gonna start updating again

[gorlab 4,321]

 

[evrydayimbyfuglien 600]

All this NHL action has me excited for my dynasty league draft coming up. 

 

Anyone want in?  I can send a link, we need about 5 replacements.