Banackock 8,044 Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 6 minutes ago, Ricer13 said: He is being publicly shamed enough for what he did so let’s not pile on and make ourselves look like the bullies here. That’s not very VHL of you.. Ricer13, AJW and twists 3 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977400 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Head Moderator frescoelmo 1,276 Posted March 27, 2023 Head Moderator Share Posted March 27, 2023 9 minutes ago, Spartan said: @Moon won't give me pick 3 for peanuts, can you moderate him please Moon is sus, I am not surprised Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977401 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nykonax 1,564 Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 46 minutes ago, Spartan said: I think the M commissioners handled this appropriately after the mod process finished fonziGG, v.2, Arce and 14 others 1 15 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977407 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gustav 6,407 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 2 hours ago, Nykonax said: Damn right, we have no shame. We like and respect AJ, and we appreciate that he was real with us in this situation. On his end, that's the way second chances should work. Someone screws up, admits it, faces the consequences, and moves on. We're not happy that this happened the way it did, but we are proud that our GMs feel that they can communicate with us honestly. And by the way, we do like the way this went--we've seen teams get docked draft picks for this kind of thing, followed immediately by the GM quitting and the new GM having to deal with it. We generally feel that if you screw up, you own the responsibility. AJ will be the only one affected by this. The Achilles/Dack situation is not how second chances should work, and I like to think we all know that. Hopefully we're all good at forgiving, moving on, and doing better. AJW 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977422 Share on other sites More sharing options...
v.2 1,406 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 CHILL OUT FONG LOL AJW 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977423 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blazzer 759 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 There are wrongs done here and rn it's been settled properly without causing a huge fuss. I do have to give credit to AJ for being honest because there aren't many people out there like him. There isn't a need for the public shaming or interrogation, I personally don't think it looks nice at all. What's done is done and kudos to the commish for handling it perfectly. v.2 and AJW 2 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977434 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grape 677 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 I do have some sympathy towards Achilles. Drinking problem is no joke. I also struggle with alcohol, both in the past and now, and it can really change how you conduct yourself for the worse. At the same time, there's a process to be done and while I'm all for seeing the good in people, you have to dedicate yourself to that process first to show that you've changed. It's clear that he has had some lasting negative impact on some members, and while I cannot speak to his character either in a positive or negative way, I hope he understands why this was done, and I hope you understand why this is the result. Frank and AJW 2 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnknownMinion 727 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 Hmm Mod bullying AJ over something quick a few people would do, Public shame really? The punishment being made public was more then enough, crazy unfair. Poor AJ. rory and Gaming Ringleader 1 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fonziGG 1,068 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 36 minutes ago, UnknownMinion said: Hmm Mod bullying AJ over something quick a few people would do, Public shame really? The punishment being made public was more then enough, crazy unfair. Poor AJ. Not sure I agree. Fong had a fair question to ask in public and he did. Did it come across strong? Yes however he's entitled to ask that question anyways. AJ, you made a mistake and honestly that's huge of you to admit to your mistake. As far as I'm concerned, this is a fair punishment and I hope all is forgiven in here. Now kill it in Houston! AJW and thadthrasher 1 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977476 Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_Ferk 766 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 51 minutes ago, fonziGG said: he's entitled agree Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977481 Share on other sites More sharing options...
twists 408 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 1 minute ago, a_Ferk said: agree double agree Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977482 Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_Ferk 766 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 Achilles was treated unfairly, he was a beloved member of the VHL twists 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977483 Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_Ferk 766 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 go Oilers GioSivo, Vkobe-v, rory and 1 other 1 2 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977484 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bojovnik 487 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 Aggressive moderating giving off very bad vibes ngl. rory, Lemorse7, OrbitingDeath and 2 others 3 1 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977495 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dom 1,445 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 16 hours ago, twists said: well i don't know how to count ok 16 hours ago, twists said: I said question like 82 times in this post pls be our next financier twists, AJW, Spartan and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977516 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Baozi 1,658 Posted March 28, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 28, 2023 (edited) 7 hours ago, Bojovnik said: Aggressive moderating giving off very bad vibes ngl. I nor anyone on the mod team moderated anyone. This punishment was handed out by he VHLM commish and mods were already arms length from the situation. I'm allowed to have my opinion on someone bringing a high risk individual back into the community illegally and I said so in a respectful manner and questioned the action. Exactly the same thing you are doing except I'm explaining to you how none of what I did is remotely moderating or related. Edited March 28, 2023 by Baozi JardyB10 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Baozi 1,658 Posted March 28, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 28, 2023 (edited) 12 hours ago, UnknownMinion said: Hmm Mod bullying AJ over something quick a few people would do, Public shame really? The punishment being made public was more then enough, crazy unfair. Poor AJ. If I hadn't replied and pointed out that Achillies had numerous violations in other communities multiple times and also harassed staff, would you know about it? Did you know yourself that he had recently had another incident? Where is the bullying in all this? Did you even read my statements? Remember when you said you were bullied a while back and you wished someone would stand up for you? I'm standing up for those I advocate for in the LGBTQ community. I asked questions so that I didn't have to assume anything. Edited March 28, 2023 by Baozi rory 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977526 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ke1vi 662 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 this thread reminds me of a parent melting down at their kid in front of everyone at McDonald's playplace twists, rory, v.2 and 3 others 5 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977528 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartan 4,402 Posted March 28, 2023 Author Share Posted March 28, 2023 49 minutes ago, Baozi said: I nor anyone on the mod team moderated anyone. This punishment was handed out by he VHLM commish and mods were already arms length from the situation. I'm allowed to have my opinion on someone bringing a high risk individual back into the community illegally and I said so in a respectful manner and questioned the action. Exactly the same thing you are doing except I'm explaining to you how none of what I did is remotely moderating or related. To clarify to everyone, we asked mods to finish their process before we got involved. Once their investigation ended, they deferred any AJ punishment to us. So I would assume the time to question AJ would have been during that investigation no? Feel like doing it after deferring it to M Commissioners defeats the point lol rory, Bojovnik, twists and 2 others 2 3 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977543 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacobcarson877 2,534 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 I do think it is very important to outline the context to everyone as to why this happened, beyond just a banned member returning without appeal. Those who hadn't done the research to put together the 3+ different aliases this person has put together in even the last year, would not have a) known Dack was ever Achilles, b) known the long and widespread issues that this person has been causing elsewhere (as their nose had been very clean here under this persona, and c) that these issues persisted after our last experience with them, as recently as this calendar year. AJ, while a little dummy in this situation, has brought together such a community in Houston, and provides tremendous value for the VHLM and Houston specifically. While a noted dummy, he has earned some faith here that while a dummy, had good intentions, and was simply trying to help someone rebuild their identity and enjoy the thing we love together. Was that his right to give? No, of course not and hence the punishment. Was Dack honestly a great member for the period of time he was here? Honestly, yes. I truly hope that he can continue to learn, grow, show some maturity and return to sim leagues with kindness and love for all. I will always stand against ___-phobia, which Achilles has always seemed to have weighing him down. But I do always have hope in my heart that people can learn and grow, and I believe the root of ___-phobia is ignorance and lack of critical thinking, which is something that can be learned. The Moderators and VHLM Commissioners had all the details, and came to their decisions according to their domains. The rules were enforced, and faith was shown in one of our best members. I can't imagine there is more to discuss than that. kirbithan, AJW, Gustav and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fonziGG 1,068 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 18 minutes ago, Spartan said: To clarify to everyone, we asked mods to finish their process before we got involved. Once their investigation ended, they deferred any AJ punishment to us. So I would assume the time to question AJ would have been during that investigation no? Feel like doing it after deferring it to M Commissioners defeats the point lol The problem with your reply is that you’re not separating the moderating job and fongs ability to be a user in the vhl space. The moderators can and have done their job. However now, Fong is allowed to take off his moderator hat, be himself and be a pissed off member. I see nothing wrong with him taking stand that this pissed him off personally. In fact this is healthier. The moderation team shouldn’t have to wear the hat 24/7. Remember that it’s a job, in the league… A simulation league. If he took this anger and applied it to AJ’s punishment, imo it would be worse. AJW, Doomsday, twists and 1 other 4 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977549 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Baozi 1,658 Posted March 28, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 28, 2023 I just want to clarify since some individuals seem to be confused about it, but there was no "moderating" of AJ. I don't believe he violated anything in the COC so I did not ask my team to investigate anything other making sure the individual being brought back was once again removed from the community. So while I could've asked this all as a moderator, I feel this wasn't warranted. Mods removed the COC violator after confirming with multiple sources who the person was. At no point in time prior did I ask AJ any of this. jacobcarson877 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977555 Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJW 2,156 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 Fong’s fine! Let them breathe! It’s words on the internet who cares just turn your computer off if they upset you lol rory, jacobcarson877 and v.2 1 2 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977558 Share on other sites More sharing options...
twists 408 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 33 minutes ago, Baozi said: I just want to clarify since some individuals seem to be confused about it, but there was no "moderating" of AJ. I don't believe he violated anything in the COC so I did not ask my team to investigate anything other making sure the individual being brought back was once again removed from the community. So while I could've asked this all as a moderator, I feel this wasn't warranted. Mods removed the COC violator after confirming with multiple sources who the person was. At no point in time prior did I ask AJ any of this. I love being violated by COC Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977564 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lefty_S 91 Posted March 28, 2023 Share Posted March 28, 2023 44 minutes ago, twists said: I love being violated by COC uwu? Vkobe-v 1 Link to comment https://vhlforum.com/topic/134430-houston-gm-punishment/page/2/#findComment-977576 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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